Post Game Random Thoughts - TT vs UT

Discussion in 'On The Field' started by Godz40acres, Nov 28, 2015.

  1. Creek

    Creek 1,000+ Posts

     
  2. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    We should have a contest to see who can watch this the most times.

     
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  3. nashhorn

    nashhorn 5,000+ Posts

    Joe Fan that is the epitome of good backs don't need a hole to be successful. It's not always a good line making a good back.
     
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  4. caryhorn

    caryhorn 5,000+ Posts

    +1
     
  5. AC

    AC 2,500+ Posts

    Royal had several down years close to .500 from 1965 to 1968, then he took off when Emory Ballard came out with the Wishbone. UT kept Royal and were rewarded with 2 more National Championships. When Mack's teams got down he never recovered and UT gave him 4 years to do so. The cultural rot had set in and when CS got here he had ALOT to recover from in terms of bad apples and a low talent pool. Since he has only had 2 years, and the freshman on this roster are as good as they are myself and many others in the fanbase see a fast resurgence. Yes new OC and offensive staff members need to be hired but look what he accomplished at Florida as DC and Louisville as HC. He is THE most admired coach from the Urban Meyer coaching tree. Simply put, 2 years is NOT enough time. I think coaching in the Big 12 caught him off guard and he has had trouble adjusting to the offense this conference plays. Hence the need for a new offensive staff and OC. It we are 6-6 or 7-5 next year cut our losses. How bad can one more year be? I don't think he will do nothing to the staff and go 6-6 next year. Not based on his past and his experience. But if he cannot adjust to life in the Big 12, oh well, he had 3 years.

    We went from Akers, to McWilliams, to Mackovic and none were successful other than 90', 95', and maybe 96'. We are in another down cycle similar to the cycle of 1984 to 1998. Changing out coaches did'nt work then and it won't work now. Who is out there that would get us to prominence immediately over CS and would coach at UT? Saban, no, Meyers, no way, Kelly, hell no (unless you can stomach probation). Herman has no where near the resume that Strong does but he will in a few years. He may be another Urban Meyer guy who DOES have Texas ties and can handle life in the Big 12. So it is a tough call, I say give Charlie one more year.
     
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  6. car54

    car54 1,000+ Posts

    Why Applewhite ? Without his STUD QB, Major lost to a 5-5 team because they couldn't score !!!!....and he is the OC there.
     
  7. AC

    AC 2,500+ Posts

    Others are saying Sonnie Cumbie. I don't follow UH that much did their QB play this weekend? They beat Navy who was ranked 15th or so. Applewhite and Cumbie are two coordinators with Texas ties doing very well at smaller Texas schools.
     
  8. car54

    car54 1,000+ Posts

    UH killed Navy with Ward playing. Without Ward they sucked.
     
  9. AC

    AC 2,500+ Posts

    BTW, TCU would not be ranked very high had Trevone Boykin been out this entire season. In a spread offense, hard to be successful without a smart QB that can make the throws and read the defense quickly to find the open man. TCU was patient with Boykin and they went 4-8 a few years ago when he was a Sophomore. He had a big Junior and Senior year. He is the most comparable B12 QB to Jerrod Heard. Great runner but he had to learn to be a passer. Again, patience with Coaches, and patience with player development.
     
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  10. hornarama

    hornarama 100+ Posts

    I wanted to be able to support a 3rd year for CS, but I just can't get there because of what I consider to be mistakes under his control. What are some of the issues?
    1) Clear loss of offensive control--i.e. not being to judge or apply assistant coaching talent to make up for his own offensive coaching inadequacies. This resulted in an offense that:
    a) bad QB selection and development (e.g. Heard should have been given the majority of snaps in the off season). If Heard couldn't be counted on, then we needed to expend every effort to get a true freshmen or JC talent in to be ready to play.
    b) bad football discipline---the number of unforced errors has been horrendous on both offense and defense. I'm talking about such things as personal fouls, and false starts. This should be independent of talent.
    c) lack of adjustment, poor offensive scheming.
    2) Charlie strong is supposed to be a very good defensive coach. For 5M a year, I expect him to over achieve with the talent on defense through training, and scheming. I sure didn't see that this year.
    3) Texas appears to have arrived at being worse than these other Texas teams:
    Baylor
    TCU
    Texas Tech
    Houston
    Texas A&M
    OU and OKST are better with probably half or more of their teams' players being from state of Texas.

    We are competitive with Rice (could have easily lost that game). I'm think we would beat UTEP, UTSA, Texas State, and SMU. It is pathetic I mention these programs in the same area code as Texas.

    I do think we would be better next year regardless whether CS stays or go. How would we be worse? This is the worst team we have had in 50 years. But why risk that the offensive coaching ineptitude would continue under CS? I just don't see much upside in waiting. I don't think a new coach (hopefully better vetted next time) will do any worse.

    Now after saying all that, I think CS will be back next year. And I will be backing the Texas team no matter what as that is what horn fans do. But I probably won't have much hope for big improvements. I haven't seen any real signs that CS can get it done on the offense. Evidently, those in favor of 3rd year for CS are depending on him hiring an OC that will in effect be independent of CS to develop an offense. I don't see that hiring a new head coach would be that much more risky than hoping for an OC wunderkind that would hire into the mess that is Texas football right now.
     
  11. AC

    AC 2,500+ Posts

    Tune in to next season and find out. That is what we all love about College Football. No other sport has the excitement of change that College Football has. I would not stick with the current offensive coordinator if I was CS. He has to know this is his last chance. Surely he will make changes. We will know that by 12/15 or so.
     
  12. wadster

    wadster 5,000+ Posts

    Get the right terms in his contract (like no buyout if you are fired for NCAA violations). But because his style doesn't work in the pros doesn't mean it doesn't work in college. He put up huge offenses at Oregon and would bring the momentum badly needed for recruiting. His style plays directly with the HS coaching in this state and he'd have the athletes he'd need to be successful. You can hate on him, but he can damn sure coach at the college level. We aren't getting Saban, Gruden, etc... We need to at least be realistic.
     
  13. rfeem

    rfeem 25+ Posts

    I haven't been on the "Fire Strong" train, because truthfully I really don't care who the coach is--i want him to win every game. I want him to succeed. I don't want any distractions in the fan base (mainly donor base) that would prevent him from succeeding.

    But I have come to the conclusion that Strong is not going to succeed--he is just the wrong man for this job. I have no doubt that he could succeed as a head coach at various places (including Florida, Georgia?), but he just won't here. He doesn't seem to understand that his style is completely unsuited to the Big 12--you have to actually score points here.

    Half the time it looks like our game plan is designed to get us to 17 points--"surely that will be enough." We are dis-jointed on offense, have inconsistent play-calling, and don't put our players in position to succeed at what they are good at.

    Surely, everyone on this Board knew that Watson needed to go after the first year. Surely, everyone on this Board knew that Swoopes could just not get it done as a starter at Texas. Apparently, however, our $5 Million coach didn't know it. We went through an ENTIRE off-season with the same QB, the same OC, and the same ridiculous offensive philosophy that embarrassed us against TCU and Arkansas to end the year in 2014. Then, of course, we're embarrassed yet again at ND, and finally a change is made--at a point when it can only be done with the greatest amount of hassle and problem to all involved, and when it is least likely to be successful. That is inexcusable.

    It is inexcusable to get shut out by ISU. It is inexcusable to fail to show up at all against TCU . It is inexcusable to decide to stop playing offense altogether against OSU. It is inexcusable to put our (now) back-up QB (perhaps the worst passer in Div. I football) in a position to throw a 40 yard pass to our least reliable receiver on a 4th and 7 in the most critical play of the TT game.

    I could go on and on, but I won't since my blood pressure goes up everytime I think about it.
    For those of you that are big Strong supporters, I ask two questions:

    1) Who has he out-coached in the two years he's been here? The only example (and an almost inexplicable one) is OU, twice. Virtually every other game we've played, the opponents coaches did a better job preparing their team than did our coaches. That is true in even games that we managed to win. (Ex. Rice).
    2) Which of the current Big 12 teams would be willing to trade their coach for ours? Any of them? No way we could get any interest in a trade for Stoops, Gundy, Briles, Patterson, Holgerson, Kingsbury, or Snyder. That leaves only ISU (who doesn't even have a coach--and I'm still not sure they'd take Strong), and Kansas (who has a brand new coach, and probably would rather take their chances with him).

    Now, I"m not saying I would want all of those guys--I wouldn't--but it is a sad state of affairs when the University of Texas has a coach that is clearly well down the list of coaches in our own league.

    I'm a fan of the team, and will root for a win any time we play, including this week against Baylor. I hope that I'm wrong about Strong and that he turns it around. I fear, however, that we are just delaying the inevitable.
     
  14. texas_ex2000

    texas_ex2000 2,500+ Posts

    Don't know how you reach this conclusion Detective.

    This team is worse this year then last year. And they were worse last year then the year before that.
     
  15. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    Baylor opens -21 against Horns

    (with 3rd string QB starting)
     
  16. Detective Shilala

    Detective Shilala 2,500+ Posts

    I don't know this But I think this because in spite of our bad record, Strong is still a decent, hard-working man. I also think he is still a good football coach and evaluator of football talent in spite of Watson, Swoopes etc (watch a game closely and pay attention to how many people making plays are freshmen and true Soph's - sure they need to mature and make less mistakes but I see a really solid core for the future)
    I don't think he can do any long term damage to the program if we give him one more year to see. At worst we have another season like this one, and the new coach staff for 2017 inherits a talented core group of players and gets us back on the rails. At best Charlie finally get some traction and if he does I think there could be a dramatic turnaround. Yes we had 3 embarrassing blowout losses this year, but we also lost a few more games lost by a combined 7 points or something.
    I could be wrong, but I think once this team matures they will have us in every game, and learn to finish close games. They have already shown a resiliency by beating OU on the heels of the TCU loss. They have seen who they can be. But it just has not become a habit yet.

    And lastly, Go Horns, Beat the F out of Baylor!
     
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  17. AC

    AC 2,500+ Posts

    I don't want to say anything too personal here. I just know I have experience with taking on a challenge that later on became much bigger than originally anticipated and therefore, it took much longer to reach the destination. However, reaching the destination may require a change of the original plan, none the less, even if delayed, if the destination is reached......I will leave it at that.

    Charlie has the background and track record, google Urban Meyer comments about Charlie Strong. Urban has gone on record saying Charlie Strong is one of the best football coaches he has ever been around. Look at the record from Louisville. Look at the freshman class on the field performance not to mention a top 10 recruiting class that contributes immediately, unlike MB classes in the past.

    Like Detective Shilala, I will dig in and be the contrarian. Keep Charlie Strong!
     
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  18. FWHORN

    FWHORN 10,000+ Posts

    I venture to guess that many of the people calling for charlie's head now were just as vocal in 2003 about Mack's head, 4 straight losses to OU, a Holi-Cotton neverending bowl berth, no conference titles and a seeming inability to get to next level. Of course in next 6 years Mack would coach Texas to a 69-12 record averaging 11 plus wins a season with one NC and another NC title game berth. Patience has never been a strong suit with Texas fans.
     
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  19. ViperHorn

    ViperHorn 10,000+ Posts

    I agree with everything AC says except the above statement. 3 Freshmen have proved they belong on the field - Williams, Jefferson and Vahe (although the weakest of the three). All of the others should have been either red shirted or played very sparingly as they are no where ready for the level of play that Texas should demand.
     
  20. Detective Shilala

    Detective Shilala 2,500+ Posts

    Holton Hill and Devontae Davis both look very very promising to me. Same goes for Boyd. They were not ready to be made starters, but they did not need a redshirt year. I think they would have earned playing time this year regardless, and they are learning fast.

    Yep, and even Charlie has admitted as much. That he thought he was going to step into a situation where all he had to do was push a few buttons but it proved to be a far greater challenge than he thought.
    I'll also add that sometimes people have to fight hardest to have success are the most steadfast after they reach it.
    (I know I am just wishful thinking. Nobody knows what next year will hold for us, I just want Strong to succeed here not just because I like the guy, but for the program)
     
  21. ProdigalHorn

    ProdigalHorn 10,000+ Posts

    My favorite is the defensive back that's trying to make the tackle at the end before his own man takes out his legs. I bet he didn't see that coming.

    Actually if you look at it, he has a great hole to run through. He benefited from an absolutely abysmal tackle attempt in the backfield, but if that guy gets blocked, he has clear sailing for at least 5 yards before he's even touched. To his credit, he shrugged the guy off, but if we're playing a real defense, that play probably goes nowhere.
     
  22. Statalyzer

    Statalyzer 10,000+ Posts

    So are Warren, Hill, and Burt not freshmen? We are starting underclassmen, all over, because they are for better or worse the best we've got.

    Rice? We might have lost? It was 42-14 before they scored twice late when the game was not in doubt. Their rushing gains and 3rd down rate were troubling. We should have played better. We did not get outplayed. We did not almost lose, or basically lose.

    McCombs' statement was racially motivated. H didn't just say he didn't think Strong wouldn't work out here. He said he wasn't even qualified, and said a head coach and former AQ defensive coordinator should drop to position coach.
     
  23. IvanDiabloHorn

    IvanDiabloHorn 1,000+ Posts

    Rice could have beaten us that night.

    McCombs did not make a racial statement, he made an accurate statement.
    2 years = 10-14, multiple blowouts, terrible offense, terrible defense, Terrible bowl loss, undisciplined players(talking about on the field), regression from year one to year two, abysmal head coaching performance in all aspects and absolutely no chance of improvement.
    If Strong has been heavily involved in the defense, then the part about him being a good assistant coach would be inaccurate.
    I believe Baylor needs slightly less than 400 yards to make this Texas team the all time leader in yards allowed for a season.
    McCombs is not a racist and he was absolutely correct on the hiring of Strong. The last two years prove Strong was not even remotely qualified.
     
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  24. 4th_floor

    4th_floor Dude, where's my laptop?

    How is that statement racially motivated? I disagree with McCombs that Charlie was not qualified. But Charlie has not performed at an acceptable level. So McCombs was right that Charlie should not have been hired.
     
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  25. AC

    AC 2,500+ Posts

    Ivan your going to eat those words next year. I have a big green egg, to cook your crow on.
    You don't get the complements from Urban Meyer after coaching together for a decade plus and go 23-3 at Louisville the 2 previous years and 37-15 overall but yet not know anything. He kicked 11 or 12 players that were on the 2 deep roster off the team. Texas was screwed before he got here. This was a total rebuild from the ground up. College Football is riddled with history of coaches coming out of mediocrity to stardom because their school stuck with them. Leach, Kelly, Snyder, Meyer, Schnellenburger*, and Saban are such coaches from early in their careers. Most coaches do not have to rebuild a program from nothing. Mack Brown sure did not, Mackovic had recruited great players but could not handle the adversity of 1997. Mack benefited greatly the next year, and he had Ricky.
     
  26. Brad Austin

    Brad Austin 2,500+ Posts

    This week's board loaded with Strong apologists is gonna sound very different next week. Funny how barely losing to a mediocre Tech team reinforced so many on Strong needing more time. Wow, how Aggy.

    Wait til Baylor routes us by 18+ with their 3rd string QB. The mood here will swing once again to the earned frustration and disapproval of the head man in charge.

    CS will have lost 15 of his first 25 games (60%). What's the most pathetic part? 10 of 25 (40%) will be 18+ points blowouts. 40% blowouts??? Really? And that deserves a 3rd try?

    Oh yeah, nevermind, he deserves another year because it's only being fair. Forget what happened over and over again on the field, he just needs more time. :puke:

    Glad this segment of Texas fans were never my teammates. The weakest links were always the guys making excuses when they screwed up assignments.

    We took a chance and made a bad hire that doesn't fit at Texas. It happens. The only fault will come when we continue to allow this doomed experiment to waste more time when we could be improving under a highly competent replacement.
     
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  27. IvanDiabloHorn

    IvanDiabloHorn 1,000+ Posts

    There has been no improvement from year one to year two. There has been no improvement throughout year two. When there is great coaching, a team will usually progress from year one to year two, and then continue to improve throughout year two after practices and games. This has not happened under Strong.
    Strong did not take over a talentless team and Strong himself admits as much.
    There is no reason to stick with this coach. Strong was given the opportunity and failed.
    Time to cut him loose.
    Although it is nice for Urban to compliment Strong, too bad he didn't teach him how to recruit.
     
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  28. Statalyzer

    Statalyzer 10,000+ Posts

    Don't know why it's so tough to understand that Strong not working out is unrelated to McCombs' statement. His resume did objectively say that that he was qualified to be more than a position coach.

    And I'm not saying beating Rice is something to boast about. But 28 points until garbage time sets in is not a close game. Saying otherwise indicates an agenda. We all know we are bad. What's the point of pretending we were worse, unless you don't think the existing situation is enough to make your case?
     
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  29. IvanDiabloHorn

    IvanDiabloHorn 1,000+ Posts

    No one I know left the stadium after the Rice game feeling good about our team or that we could not have lost the game. Rice doomed themselves on turnovers.
    Rice 30 first downs, Texas 11 first downs. Rice TOP 44.02, Texas TOP 15.58.
    Rice total yards 462, Texas total yards 277(including a 61 yard pass play).
    Texas scored touchdowns on a punt return and a fumble returned for a touchdown.
    Texas also had 6 and 28 yard td drives.
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2015
  30. Detective Shilala

    Detective Shilala 2,500+ Posts

    It won't make a difference for me. I am realistic. I am not optimistic we will beat Baylor. I'll still be bummed about our horrible record. And no 4 and 7 is not acceptable to me, but I still want to see what can be done next year with Strong in charge.

    Exactly. A broken clock is still accurate twice a day. Oh but Saban..., LOL!
     
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