Fox News sides with Trump/Spicer in war against media

Discussion in 'West Mall' started by NJlonghorn, Jan 21, 2017.

  1. NJlonghorn

    NJlonghorn 2,500+ Posts

    Spicer went to war with the media today, aggressively defending Trump's absurd claim that Friday's crowd was the largest audience to ever watch an inauguration. Is that really where Trump wants to put his stake in the ground?

    I guess the truth is that Trump will drive as many stakes in the ground as he can, truth be damned.

    Fox News is the only major site I've seen that hasn't called Spicer on the blatant lies.
     
  2. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez Beer Prophet

    The Spicer "conference" was ridiculous and probably had some false information in it. The problem is that the media critics who are ripping him don't have clean hands and have blown their own credibility. My guess is that Trump is going to be as fair and respectful to the media as the media was to Trump during the general election campaign.
     
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  3. Horn6721

    Horn6721 10,000+ Posts

    I was watching Fox News when Spicer came on. The people live then were pretty shocked and certainly did not defend Spicer or Trump for approaching it like that.
    Which "blatant lie" did Fox News defend?

    I just read the Fox News account of the Spicer briefing and do not see any defending.

    It as a stupid move on Trump's part.
    Edit to add I just turned on Fox and all the commentators are criticizing Trump/Spicer pointing out Trump is wrong to say there were more people at his inaguration and asking the best IMO question
    Why waste time on trivial matters?
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2017
  4. Run Pincher

    Run Pincher 2,500+ Posts

    Why would anyone expect a large crowd for Trump's inauguration? It wasn't a holiday. Most Trump supporters had to go to work.
     
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  5. UTChE96

    UTChE96 2,500+ Posts

    Chris Wallace on Fox News Sunday just skewered Priebus on this. I know folks on the left don't like Fox News but there is no denying that their news division (not their opinion shows) presents a more balanced lineup of stories than any other network. Fox News Sunday is pretty much the only Sunday morning news show still worth watching.
     
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  6. NJlonghorn

    NJlonghorn 2,500+ Posts

    Fair. I typed the thread title first, saying Fox News "sides with" Trump/Spicer. By the time I typed the actual text, I said they had not called Trump on the lies. That was true about the article I linked to. Like you, I have seen some stuff on Fox News since then calling Spicer out.

    This was my main point. Trump has many legitimate beefs with the media, and has the upper hand. Why blow that (or even some of that) on this issue???
     
  7. texas_ex2000

    texas_ex2000 2,500+ Posts

    No one at Fox news has been "defending," whatever that means, Spicer's presser. They were all taken back too. The closest to defending is that a few of their pundits, such as Eric Bolling on The Five, were saying this isn't your father's Press Office and Trump will obviously hold the media accountable on everything to his supporters as the media holds him accountable.

    Did you actually watch it? I saw it live and he never said there were more people in DC for Trump's inauguration. He stated, that there is no way to officially tell because the Park Service hasn't released numbers and that pictures of the mall aren't a reliable gage because security measures are higher then 2009.

    He did cite facts of what are known, Metro ridership numbers, the capacity of crowd sections which were full, and television viewership. His claim that this was the most watched inauguration is based on television viewership. IIRC he said "across the world," when he made that claim. Not that I give a sh1t, but every fact Spicer gave had 3x more journalistic integrity than a no-context 2009/2017 split shot of the 300m in front of the Capitol which every station including Fox were running.

    What do I think of all of this? Of course I think it's dumb. It was an ego statement. There was really no point to it. Trump could have had Spicer cover this on Monday. But here's the thing. I didn't engineer one of the most historic political campaigns in history. I don't think you appreciate how loathed the media is in this country. Take a guess and then multiply it times 2...and then add 1. That's how bad. So when the media will accuse Trump of being a closet racist by removing MLK's bust from the Oval Office, his ego will not take it. And I bet a lot of other people's too. That's the definition of Fake News, which I thought we all wanted to condem. Would you wait 3 days to correct a reporter who called you a racist? And while I thought it was dumb for Spicer to get up there, I simultaneously liked that Trump and Spicer stood up for themselves.

    Newflash...Trump has a big ego. If you didn't like Trump, whatever Spicer does won't endear him to you. So he's not losing anything there. Trumpers will eat it up. And for those who reluctantly voted for him, you're not going to care as long as he delivers on his policy promises. And don't forget the media as a punching bag is hardly a losing strategy
     
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    Last edited: Jan 23, 2017
  8. texas_ex2000

    texas_ex2000 2,500+ Posts

    I'm not sure if that was tounge and cheeck. But it's 1,000% true. Obama supporters who went to his inauguration were young people and students who don't work or decided to skip work and live in East Coast metro areas with access to convenient cheap transportation (train/bus/short drive) and college buddies in DC to crash with. As someone who lived in NYC in 2009, a lot of them took the train from NYC in the morning and took it back that evening. And Obama was the first African American president, giving extra incentive for every history nerd within traveling distance to attend his swearing in.

    Who are Trump supporters? People in the middle of the country with kids who can't afford to take time off/afford a baby sitter or afford to take a family roadtrip/afford an expensive plane ticket(s)/afford a hotel to satisfy some romantic political adventure. I'm sure the millions of people at his rallies in the Midwest the media forgot to cover would have loved to come to DC if they could have afforded it.

    Inaugurations and protests are young and rich persons game. I wish that wasn't the case. Look at all these women here in DC wearing their stupid pink hats. They are either young or affluent or both.

    From the media, you'd think with the "little enthusiasm" Trump gets compared to the "millions" marching against him yesterday, that...you know...he should have lost the election.
     
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    Last edited: Jan 22, 2017
  9. horninchicago

    horninchicago 10,000+ Posts

    ^^^ Well said.
     
  10. mchammer

    mchammer 10,000+ Posts

    The crowd yesterday were the same people who were in Clinton's coalition of single white women, youth, and minorities. Note most marchers came from east coast cities that were a few hours drive away like NYC, etc. that Clinton won by easy margins. At the end of the day, Trump won the white women vote by 10 points.
     
  11. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    Regardless of which media was critical of Trump, what was Spicer thinking by blatantly lying to the media about something so easily fact checked regarding inauguration attendance?
     
  12. texas_ex2000

    texas_ex2000 2,500+ Posts

    what are you talking about?
     
  13. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    What? You don't know that Spicer lied to the media? I find that hard to believe as it was the genesis of the initial post on this thread.
     
  14. djimaplon

    djimaplon 250+ Posts

    Just more confirmation the post truth world is the new normal and one that will be built on alternative facts.
     
  15. bystander

    bystander 10,000+ Posts

    It was disappointing to see Trump (or his press secretary by extension) become involved in an argument about the number of people who attended his inauguration versus Obama's. He must know that Obama's election was a historic event that was thought impossible in our lifetime. Millions of people felt proud of America at that moment because they could finally say there was hope for a child of a historically oppressed race to be President. Many people thought it ushered in what some called the "post-racial" era in America. Though that hope now seems distant it still seems quite obvious to me that at the time, Obama's election was a once in a lifetime moment and there is no need to feel slighted by the nation's reaction to that seminal moment. What I want to know is why Trump cannot see this?

    I think the politicians underestimate our ability to handle reality. Trump didn't have to say the things he said about Mexicans to gain support from those who feel immigration laws are an important subject. All he had to do was forcefully (and often) insist on the policy he believes to be true and most effective. He could have just said that an open border makes it easy for criminals and terrorists to enter our country because in my view it's just common sense. You don't have to say that illegal Mexicans immigrants are rapists or whatever he said. They aren't though some are. Obviously. Just like some white people are. He over-reached. He could have easily gotten the point across in other ways. Now he is being attacked over his rhetoric and he opened the door. And it will stay open if he continues to make outlandish remarks that are totally unsupportable.
     
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  16. djimaplon

    djimaplon 250+ Posts

    If you dont know why, you haven't been paying attention.

    Actually he did because that is who he is (at least when on stage) and what his supporters want to hear him say.
     
  17. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    The Trump supporters clearly didn't want someone sensible, willing to have a rational conversation with voters in a battle of ideas. They wanted the shock jock. The bully. The candidate that spouted fantasy versions of what they believe is true with confidence. They won. Now he should be held accountable for the use of "alternative facts", regardless of whether it appeases him or not. I for one am comforted by the fact that so many people were willing to stand up in the streets on Saturday, against the "Trump movement".
     
  18. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez Beer Prophet

    I listened to Kellyann Conway on Meet the Press try to answer (or really try not to answer) that question. It was ugly. She did the dance as well as it can be done, but it was a mess.
     
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  19. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    Spicer and Conway were eerily reminiscent to this fellow on Saturday.
    [​IMG]
     
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  20. OUBubba

    OUBubba 5,000+ Posts

    There should be no expectation that Trump's crowd should rival Obama's. The first one was historic as he was the first black President. Additionally, the younger and more mobile are naturally going to be there. Trump is not coming in as popular and his base is middle America and, generally, older. He should have just been humble and gracious and moved on down the road to making America better than it was. Why he had to make it into a penis measuring contest is really the more curious aspect and really is a sad statement on the next 48 months (or less).
     
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  21. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    +1
     
  22. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    To Spicer's credit in today's PC, he all but admitted the data he had received from the Inauguration committee was incorrect. Of course, he did go on to adequately defend the "most viewed" claim. They are adding an assumed amount of web viewers on top of the TV ratings. Given the increased proliferation of internet viewers that's probably a safe assumption.
     
  23. BrntOrngStmpeDe

    BrntOrngStmpeDe 1,000+ Posts

    Agreed. Just the fact that 90% of DC votes dem's would make the difference in crowd size, but by letting his fricking ego get in the way he's reinforcing rather than counteracting opinions about him and his administration.

    Democrats were never going to go along easily with his agenda but every time he does BS like this, it makes it harder for R's in swing states to side with him and eventually they'll spend more time defending any votes that they take because they'll be associated with Trump trigger words.

    I sure hope the R's get things in gear quickly. I don't think mid-terms are going to be kind to our party.

    It's a different battle now. He's won the campaign. Move on to being president already.
     
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  24. texas_ex2000

    texas_ex2000 2,500+ Posts

    Give us examples of what he lied about. Your link just talks about how the media reacted to it.

    I didn't see the presser about his being upfront about some of the numbers he was given.
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2017
  25. NJlonghorn

    NJlonghorn 2,500+ Posts

    Three inaccuracies I remember off the top of my head:
    • He said Metro ridership was up compared to the 2009 and 2013 inaugurations. In fact, ridership was way down (and fact was lower than in 2005, too).
    • He said part of the reason for smaller crowds on the mall was that everyone had to go through metal detectors. In fact, no metal detectors were used for entry to the mall this year.
    • He said that the crowd looked smaller than it really was because tarps were used to protect the grass for the first time, visually highlighting open areas. In fact, the tarps were first used in 2013.
    It is impossible to know whether Spicer made this stuff up, or someone else made it up and he just repeated it. But there is no reasonable dispute over the fact that he was spewing falsehoods.
     
  26. texas_ex2000

    texas_ex2000 2,500+ Posts

    Metro ridership reports were based on certain periods of time. Before 11am, all day etc. He had very specific numbers, from Metrorail. Did he correct it today?

    Magometers - In 2013, I was able to drive my car 1 block off of Pennsylvania and 10th St NW and park then walk through a bag check (one block off Penn) without any problem. Magnometer or not, that was not the case this year. Did the Park Police correct him?

    Tarp - He said white tarp. The Tarps in 2013 were not white. Is that split screen reflective of equivalent time of the swearing in?

    Here's what I know too: MLK bust is in the Oval Office. That's a pretty inflammatory fake news story. As historic and well attended Obama's 2009 inauguration was, I also find it extremely credible that more people around the world through various mediums viewed the Trump inauguration.

    I will say, whether anything he said was true or false, it was a stupid press conference with a capital S. And if you're going to make a bold statement, take more than 24 hours to facts check these things. Also, why do we care if he has a big ego? As long as he delivers on his policies, it doesn't matter. Some of the greatest athletes of all-time used made-up/perceived slights to motivate them to win.

    Trump should dump Spicer and hire me.
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2017
  27. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    The Metrorail numbers cited by Spicer have been unverifiable. Essentially, they were not the numbers Metrorail publicly reported albeit he clearly stated they were. He didn't correct himself today but did say (paraphrasing) "sometimes the media has it's facts wrong, please afford me that same leeway".

    There were no magnometers in user on the mall. in 2017 or 2013.

    I can't find them now but there were many photos by media of the white plastic laid down in 2013 too. I believe the National Park Service confirmed that they were there in 2013.

    What does this have to do with the inauguration? In that case, the reporter publicly apologized for their error (Door and Secret Service agent in front of the bust) and Trump accepted their apology. That seems like a distraction from the inauguration fracas now.

    On that we can agree. It was pretty dumb to even make it an issue.
     
  28. BrntOrngStmpeDe

    BrntOrngStmpeDe 1,000+ Posts

    How the president (and/or his staff/cabinet) conducts himself does matter. A simple tweet from him moves markets and if you believe his blustering, is capable of altering CEO's business dealings. He needs to be mindful of his words, deeds and actions.

    He and his office looked ridiculous this weekend arguing about crowd size when they had no pictures or data to back up their claim.

    What comes out of his mouth and his office matter and he needs to start acting like it. He has the conch, he doesn't need to grandstand do be heard. He doesn't need to be outlandish and he doesn't need to defend every perceived slight he gets from the media. He ran for president. If he couldn't take regular criticism then he should have stayed in his world of sycophants that had to please him to keep their jobs.

    He is a jackass....hopefully a useful jackass that lives up to his campaign promises...but still a jackass. And he needs to get it under control.
     
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  29. Garmel

    Garmel 5,000+ Posts

    Maybe Trump did lie(or not) but who the hell cares over something this trivial. Most of the libs in this country didn't give a damn about Obama's lies about the ACA, which is something that is actually important.
     
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  30. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    Argument deflection.jpg
     
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