Zuckerberg calls for universal income

http://www.cnbc.com/2017/05/25/mark...universal-basic-income-at-harvard-speech.html

Amazing that he thinks this is a good idea. Everyone makes enough to live no matter what they do, so they can be free to take risks. In other words, why settle for that job as a garbage collector when you can go try to become the next Internet billionaire like he did. Result: no more garbage collectors. What a wonderful world it will be.

Actually it's probably more likely we'll have a nation occupied entirely by social justice warriors, artists, surfers and professional video game players. The only thing that matters is that your job "matters" to you.

 

He is obviously a college dropout.

 

The economy is changing and computers, robots, machines and foreigners are doing a lot of work that used to provide a decent living for people who were not especially smart or skilled. I'm not for subsidizing sloth or laziness.

But we have to start thinking about, in this society of plenty, how to provide sustenance for everyone. A lot of ideas sound wacky at first don't work out, but they get us thinking about issues where we may not be optimizing our country's potential. I know a lot of posters on this board are very comfortable with the idea that low skilled folks working very hard checking your groceries, roofing your house, mowing your yard, etc. living a hand-to-mouth existence. The gulf between the haves and the have nots is expanding rapidly. Too many of us being too poor is going to create problems for those of us who are prosperous. It doesn't have to be a zero sum equation. Money in the hands of consumers can make rich people richer.

 

I never thought being a bagger at a grocery store was a career position when I was doing it in high school.

I'm sure this will sound insensitive to the liberals on here, but if you are working as a roofer or whatever and living hand-to-mouth, that is your problem. Why should I pay more for a new roof than what it already costs?

Fact is, not everyone is as motivated as others to get the education and just have the drive and desire to move beyond a job like being a roofer, etc. I know this statement will be met with a lot of resistance from some, but it's true.

 

I wrote about this during the election

Hillary and her flock has fed judge nominees ready to go who were willing to read a right to "minimum livable income" into the Constitution

 

Technology is changing everything. It's sad to watch brick-and-mortar stores I've shopped in my whole life, like Sears, dying and taking those retail jobs with them. Amazon and online retailers are devouring everything like The Nothingness devoured the landscape in "The Neverending Story". The same is true of many low end jobs.

The answer is NOT to give everybody some stipend to scrape by on. The answer is to force them retrain themselves to do something that will contribute to society. As Sam Kinison once said about world hunger; "quit sending the starving people food. Don't send them another morsel. Send them U-hauls so they can move where the ******* food is"!!!!

 

Zuckernoggin is a nutball but he did find his way into the elite income earners with this social media apparatus. Bully for him.

Crockett ... while this is true what you've stated above, it's not because any particular person/group of persons is "comfortable" exploiting others, necessarily (though, when is the last time any one here purchased something not made in China? ... absolute answers not required, I'm quite certain the meaning is understood)

the chasm is being created by folks in zuckerdoodle's strata ... in govt regulation. Protecting theirs and taking yours in the auspice of "fairness."

Let Zuckerwagon give his away first and realize only 40K/year or whatever is the proposal.

All he has to do is look at the ol boy in Seattle? Dan Price? That didn't last long.

 

I'm more interested to see how many different ways @ShAArk92 can twist Zuccerwomper's name in this thread than anything Zuckerbeerguzzler has to say. Are his employees all getting rich on their income he pays them, I wonder?

 

Nor is everyone gifted with a 110 to 130 IQ which is my rough estimate of where most posters on this board fall. Raw IQ can be moved a little through dilligence and hard work. But just as for me running a 5 flat 40 was not in the genes, working as a nurse or teacher is beyond the intellectual ability of many. Often they work hard and are very productive ... just not very good at leveraging/negotiating that into adequate compensation.

 

Meanwhile ... those who can learn to weld are making double-triple a teacher/nurse

Didn't need the government to do it either.

 

I remember when that was true.

 

It's STILL true. Ditto HVAC AND plumbing.

Teachers here are making 40-50k

A self employed/contract welder will make 110-135 without breaking a sweat. No seniority step rate either.

That's straight outta trade school unless working for a company.

 

That's quite a bit higher than what the Bureau of Labor Statistics says. They list the median annual comp at ~$39k. Longview, TX has the highest concentration and there the mean comp is $51,580.

Needless to say we have an emerging crisis in our labor force being brought about by automation. Within the next 30-50 years, the trucking industry will be using autonomous trucks. As much as 70% of our existing workforce can be displaced due to automation. It's not just manual labor jobs. Teachers will be an early displaced profession. Some like to point to immigration as driving our employment challenges but automation has been and will continue to be a vastly bigger threat to the lower and middle classes.

 

perhaps these guys here in Cross Timbers are selling drugs ... but that's what I'm told ... they aren't typically too shy about showing it either. 3 of these kids have brand new Dodge Diesel welding trucks ... custom beds, of course. Easily 100K plus. My last house (2006) cost me 67K in this area.

anyhow ... point is ... as Mike Rowe has been preaching for several years now ... automation isn't replacing necessary jobs and a lot of these necessary jobs are worthy careers esp for self-employement, which is really the only way to be the most free.

 

I'd suspect it's like most of America's problem, debt. Most of America lives well beyond their means thus that new truck, custom trailer, etc.

Worforce analytics is part of my profession. The self-employment aspect is also a major trend, not just for blue collar roles but also traditional corporate roles. This is why health insurance being tied to your employment is outmoded. The trend is for freelancers to work for multiple companies on multiple projects simultaneously.

 

Certainly there are worthwhile careers where talent is needed and no college classes required.. Our school systems -- run by people who spent a lot of time in college -- do a poor job of assessing non-academic talent and selling vocational education.

 

Washington State's new Superintendent of Public Education ran on a platform of bringing back more emphasis on vocation programs. I voted for him for this reason. Schools have focused so much on science and math training at the expense of vocational programs. Children that struggle in those areas are naturally being "left behind" because there is no other option for them.

 

Crockett ... could it be because every American ... and non-American ... is supposed to be going to college ... and that bill should be paid by the taxpayer.

Therefore ... if everyone's going to college ... why even look at trade school aptitude?

I'm proud of my accomplishment at The University and I'll be Burnt Orange "Til Gabriel Blows His Horn," but frankly ... most of the academics were completely useless.

 

College costs, like medical costs, are way out of whack as colleges build facilities and programs to outshine one another and kids don't think twice about making educational choices that will cost 6 times the annual salary they will make upon graduation.

 

I think I understand your meaning .... but science and math is at the heart of producing good vocationals, too.

 

because we're institutionally guaranteeing the cost, too.

When costs are guarantee'd, what happens to price?

 

it is worth noting that Z got his education at Harvard----I have friends who attended there and they are all open border advocates and most share ideas such as the ones expressed by Z here.

Open borders, pay off the proles with a minimum base salary, etc.

Not the country I want to live in or the kind of people I want running things. My dislike for that terminal lunatic Trump does not exceed my contempt for the Ivy League saviors.

 

Where was this benevolence and integrity when he tried to steal his former best friend's equity? Keep trying to rehabilitate your image Zuckerberg. We all know that you are still a douche.

 

Exactly how fast is the gap between the haves and have nots expanding, and what is the definition of a "have" and "have not"?

I would also suggest that a great deal of thinking has already been done on this topic, and a great deal of empirical evidence exists concerning the best system to increase the wealth of the greatest number of people.

 

Going back to Zuckerberg's suggestion for creating a universal income; where does this "surplus" exist that would be distributed to the masses? The government already runs huge deficits, so it won't come from there. About the only surplus I see that could be tapped for the masses would be the enormous stashes of wealth held by people like Zuckerberg, but I don't see him volunteering to dish out his fortune.

 

There are a lot of things that would be useful to society, but they aren't all profitable, hence they don't get done. Training someone to attain a specific skill doesn't guarantee that skill will allow the person to make a living using it.

 

Except for unrealized gains he has in his assets, his wealth is already circulating in the economy. People don't "stash wealth". They put it in the bank, where it is used for loans, or buy assets.

 

I think the timeline in the trucking industry could be closer to 3-5 years rather than 30-50.

One of the problems with these technology/automation developments is that they are deflationary. That should be a good thing, but the way our monetary system is designed, it would bankrupt the system. As prices plummet, so do wages. Because there is such a large debt overhang, both within the private sector as well as all levels of government, there simply would not be enough money collected to service the debt.

 

Yes, but in today's world of near zero interest, it is only the powerful and connected players (large banks and corporations) that can take advantage of low interest rates, giving them an unfair advantage in terms of securing loans to create more productive assets for themselves.

For example, Blackstone purchased billions of dollars worth of real estate following the housing crash. They were able to borrow money at less than 1% and pay cash, something the regular Joe could not do. So the system as it now functions tends to make the wealthy even wealthier.

 

The same arguments were formerly made about buggy manufacturers. People adapt to changes, and new industries/products/services are constantly created that require workers.