A Different Take... Stay the Course and Press On

Discussion in 'On The Field' started by LHABSOB, Nov 17, 2019.

  1. LHABSOB

    LHABSOB 1,000+ Posts

    It has been 24 hrs since the loss in Ames. And let’s be clear- it was a loss to a decent team on the road. Texas was a 7 pt underdog. This wasn’t the 2016 loss to Kansas. It wasn’t 2014/2015 TCU nor the 2000’s embarrassments to OU. It wasn’t 50-7 against Baylor in 1989. It was a last second loss to a decent team who had last several close ones themselves this year. Heck in my opinion it wasn’t even close to the worse loss for Herman at UT- see Maryland x2 or TTU 2017 or TCU this year.

    And for the record, I wasn’t doing backflips when we hired Herman. I thought he had gotten hot in HTown and viewed his antics as quirky. And after the Charlie fiasco, I wasn’t going to openly embrace any coach short of Darrell Royal himself as our next coach. I was very critical of Herman and staff in his first 2 years. I was disappointed in 7-6 in 2017. I was very critical and convinced we made the wrong hire leaving the Maryland rainstorm in DC. However as I walked out of the Sugar Bowl earlier this year (yes that was THIS CALENDAR YEAR), I told my wife and friends that I was finally on-board. Has the season fallen short of expectations- Yes. Have there been huge coaching blunders- Yes. Do I think we need to overhaul the program and replace the HC and all the staff- No.

    I hate excuses- My high school coach taught me the saying “they are like #$holes, everyone has one and they all stink”. But I think we are fooling ourselves if we don’t think the injuries have had a major impact on our season. The reality is we are NOT deep in talent. As much as I groan and chide Zucker for the shots at Charlie, he is right that the cupboard was not ripe with 3 deep talent across both sides of the ball. The injuries to Sterns, Foster, Thompson, Chris Brown have all had an impact on the D including several others like McCollouch, and Green missing multiple games. On the Offensive side of the ball the injuries to Collin J, JWhitt and Cade Brewer have all been significant. Are injuries part of the game and do all teams have to battle- Yes. But when you don’t have depth and lose time with those significant contributors- it hurts and it has hurt. And let’s not forgot that we lost some considerable talent from last year like Gary J, LJH, Omenihu, and even players like PJ Locke, Kris Boyd and Hager that I thought we would be fine without. We just aren’t that deep in talent.

    Is it possible that some of the perceived poor play-calling- “cushion on coverage”, “pressing to get TD vs FG”, “conservative offensive plays” and especially the ineffective blitzes are all efforts by the coaches to cover up the fact that we aren’t as talented as everyone thinks. Last year, the bull rush by Sam to get 1-2 yds was effective, even when the D knew what we are doing. This year, we can’t get a yard on it to save our life. I think that’s talent. I was frustrated at setting up the winning FG vs putting our nose down and getting the TD last week vs KState. I think Herman would have liked to flex our muscles and push it in and trust the D- but we don’t have the talent.

    I think the miscues are glaring when we lose or when games come down to a wining FG like K & KST. The reality is I have seen plenty of other top programs and coaches with ridiculous coaching errors this season. Just a week ago- Matt Campbell was criticized for going for 2 vs the tie and OT when his team had all the 2nd half momentum. And did anyone see the incredible Dave Aranda with game in hand vs Bama after LSU went up 12 with 1:37 in the game play press coverage and have Tua hit DSmith for 85 yds on 1 play to cut the lead to 5. If Bama had recovered the onside kick, they likely would have won. While on the subject of Aranda (apparently the best DC since Fuller), LSU gave up 37 pts and 611 yds (402 rushing!!!) yesterday to Ole Miss. Last week they gave up 541 yds and 41 pts to Bama with Tua at about 60% limping around. Heck they even gave up 530 yds and 38 pts to our incompetent offense. It must be nice to have Joe Burrows having one of the best QB season in the history of the SEC.

    So, my take- is maybe we all need to tap the brakes. There will be a proper time for evaluation at the end of the season. From a recruiting standpoint I would love to see Samples and Traylor back on campus but I don’t know if they have a fit on this staff. For now, let’s hope for the best and hope that this team can pull it together for Baylor and TTU and maybe win a nice bowl game. I would rather hold out hope and remember the confidence I had in this staff and the direction we were heading walking out of the Sugar Bowl than live under the assumption that the grass is always greener on the other side- Hook Em- Flame Away.
     
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  2. MajesticII

    MajesticII 1,000+ Posts

    LSU is not a good example if you're trying to sell excuses for coaches' miscues....That defense sucks. They couldn't stop our pitiful offense. They are winning because of a new OC who is putting players in a position to win.Much like Riley did OU last year.......unlike the crap show that is the Texas offensive scheme .....
     
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  3. BallsofSteerToo

    BallsofSteerToo 100+ Posts

    As in Dawn of the Dead , the Frat Boys cometh.
    Damn you LHABSOB.
     
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  4. Run Pincher

    Run Pincher 2,500+ Posts

    I don't think there's many people that post here that get pissed because Texas lost to a good solid team on the road. The reason people are pissed is because of the way Texas loses. And that's because it now awfully apparent we have a coach that's learning on the job as one of the highest paid head coaches in the country.

    One thing that bothers me so much the inability to prepare for a game from the other coaches perspective. What must the other team do to win? If the other team has determined they're not going to let you establish a running game no matter what even if they do have a weak run defense it means slice them up through the are to open up the running game. You can't do exactly what the other team wants you to do. Duh! It's just not that difficult.

    The other thing is all the stupid mistakes, penalties and miscues. How can you not tell your punt returner don't field it when we have nothing to gain? How can you not tell your defense, "OK guys, even if they make this FG we still have time to drive down and get our own FG to win so the one thing we absolutely can't do is give them a 1st down on a penalty. That's the absolute one thing that will cost us the game." And ridiculous penalties like the one on Green vs KSU, many late hits by Foster, etc. etc.

    One more thing, worst in the fing country in missed tackles. How do you get that from a team that recruits top 20 talent without horrible coaching on the fundamentals?

    This is why people are so pissed, not because Texas lost to a good team with a number of players out with injury. Ad I'm sick and tires of hearing the youth excuse. Most of the penalties and stupid mistakes I learned playing flag football when I was 8-11 years old.
     
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  5. Detective Shilala

    Detective Shilala 2,500+ Posts

    Good summary Run Pincher.

    Our only blow out win was week 1 against latech. Our best game was a loss in which we probably should have beat a top 5 team There were no injuries at that time- just a horribly unprepared defense and special teams. The coaches blew it! then our most impressive victory is a win against OSU in which Gundy had a total brainfart and would win going away if he had a do-over.

    That was the prime of our season folks. It’s been downhill from there and yes The injuries didn’t help. but we were never a playoff or conference championship team to begin with. Not with these coaches.
     
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  6. FWHORN

    FWHORN 10,000+ Posts

    This season has been incredibly frustrating because of the high expectations. I think most everyone came in so hungry to get the first conference title in a decade that the failure to even be in the championship game is a gut shot. But, when you step back and rationally look at things your post is pretty much on point.

    My college and law school years were the McWilliams era and the start of Mackovick. Texas had a grand total of 3 winning seasons during those seven years 88-94 and only two bowl berths so I know what it is like to be frustrated with Texas football. We all got spoiled with Mack's incredible run during the 2000's and forget that it took Mack into his fourth season to win 10 games and that in his season 3 a lot of people wanted him gone after losing to an awful Stanford team and getting beat 63-14 by OU. I am on board with staying the course and not complete panic burn it all down.
     
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  7. Chop

    Chop 10,000+ Posts

    Herman should (and will) get at least another year. Some of his underling coaches on the other hand...

    Aside from beating Baylor, Tech, and some so-so team in a so-so bowl game, the immediate problems are stemming the tide of recruit decommits, signing a good 2020 recruiting class, and not losing key players to the transfer portal. You know, we could also use that transfer portal to shore up some weak positions. Just saying.
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2019
  8. Clean

    Clean 5,000+ Posts

    This is the correct answer. As I said on another thread, Herman and Sons is criminally liable for this year's team's lack of discipline. How many times when we had to have a defensive stop has our "D" practically penalized the other team right down the field?

    Good teams don't beat themselves. We do! On that last ISU drive what did we have; 2 PIs and the Piece De Resistance, bonehead play of the year, offsides penalty! Herman can't be blamed for all the injuries, but he can and should be blamed for the stupid mental mistakes that have plagued us all season..
     
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  9. Clean

    Clean 5,000+ Posts

    The other thing Herman can and should be blamed for is the awful game management, like the turning down of easy field goals to go for it on 4th down. When you're on the road playing a decent team, you take the points. He needs to burn that damn binder.
     
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  10. RainH2burntO

    RainH2burntO 2,500+ Posts

    The thing is, all the stuff that the fans are griping about are things almost all teams who aren't elite do. Look around, any team who isnt 9-1, 8-2, 10-0, 7-3 right now have big issues, coaching and otherwise.
    The problem to me is the fan base has become so frustrated, demanding and at times unrealistic that anything short of a 10-2 season with only "pretty losses" will do or they will go nuts. (And they would still go nuts at the 2 losses and how they happened)
    Guess what?? There are very few pretty losses in football.
    You usually lose because you make stupid mistakes that drive fans nuts. Welcome to reality. We aren't a top 5, top 10 program now...and I think it would be alot more fun if we just humbled ourselves a bit, grew an ounce of patience, and watch and see if this thing can grow into something.
    And I am certain it would alleviate some unnecessary pressure on the boys. Would I rather see perfection? Of course. Should we ask for and hope for better? Yes. Hold the staff accountable? Of course. You want UT to be elite? I get it.
    I'm just saying this fan base needs to chill a bit and quit acting like the petulant, narcissistic self-serving public-at-large we see around us today. There's enough already. Lets enjoy our sports please.
    I wonder if the ISU fan base has been constantly criticizing their team and coach this year? Wonder if they've been as negative? Wonder if our fans were their fans if they would have still won that game Saturday? Oh yeah, "We are UT, right? Don't talk like that. We are The University of Texas...not ISU."
    I think you'll find part of the problem right there if you look.
    Pretty soon no decent coach or player in his right mind will want to come to Austin.
    Hook'em.
     
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    Last edited: Nov 18, 2019
  11. bystander

    bystander 10,000+ Posts

    Did you hear Herman's arrogant post-game comments about running the ball late in the game. Whether he's right or wrong he's not learning. He is sticking to a fundamental approach to the game that he has in mind.

    Can a binder learn?
     
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  12. Run Pincher

    Run Pincher 2,500+ Posts

    Yes, I certainly did and every time TH says something like we didn't think we would run 2x and get 0 yards I would like to say to his face, I knew that's exactly what would happen because ISU had no choice but to sell out to stop the run. Like I said above, what the other team has to do doesn't seem to enter TH's thought process.

    The problem with a binder is it doesn't include situational awareness. The answer to most questions in life include, it depends on the situation.
     
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  13. bystander

    bystander 10,000+ Posts

    Wasn't it obvious at that point that they had completely stopped the run? It seems we had rushed over twenty time for less than sixty yards total. Did I hear that correctly?
     
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  14. old65horn

    old65horn 1,000+ Posts

    I totally agree with run Pincher. There is something wrong with the coaches when my wife and I can see things from our couch watching the game. When Texas got the stop with a little more than 3 minutes left, we both said please do not go conservative and just run basic run plays or we would lose. I yelled "NO" when we trotted out tight ends to start the series. ISU was totally committed to stopping the run and they had accomplished that the entire game, so NOW it was going to work? The same thing happened last year in the last second losses to WV and Okie Lite. I knew what was coming in both games and it did, they scored and we lost. Anybody paying attention knew it was going to be a QB run around end after faking a dive to the RB.

    That said, I am not in favor of kicking TH to the curb. All the talk on this site is just like looking at the aggy board, congrats. While I am on the soap box, the talk about kicking Green off the team is, in my opinion, is disgusting. The hit was not intentional and he he does not have a history of dirty play. He is a good kid, and I thought his punishment was enough. Baylor had a DB that had 3 targeting fouls THIS year, he was playing. TH does not hesitate in disciplinary action. He suspended Holtom Hill, his best CB, so he has proven that he holds the line.

    Right now, I am in favor of getting a new special teams coach and actually teaching special teams. I am also in favor of getting an actual BB coach in mems and women. That is all, I am getting dowen off my soap box and yielding to all the experts on the board.

    By the way, the defense has played pretty well the last two games with the 3 man front. still and outside contain problem. One other "but", if we had finished the sack, which we should have, to start the 3rd quarter, that was also critical in retrospect.
     
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  15. Chop

    Chop 10,000+ Posts

    Yep. And Sam had a hot hand during recent drives. ISU stacked the front. See what they’re giving you, and stick with the hot hand until they stop it.

    There’s a place for the binder, but sometimes that place is on the shelf. Like so many other human endeavors, sometimes you have to think on your feet.
     
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  16. Horns11

    Horns11 10,000+ Posts

    And therein lies my confusion about why Tom is considered such a great coach. A guy like Saban or Belichick or whoever would look at what had happened with the run ALL GAME and determine that we needed to pick up at least one 1st down in order to win, and running the ball wasn't the way to do it. But he gets out there in his press conference with the "aw shucks who could have possibly determined that we'd get zero yards on 1st and 2nd down with the run," and someone in the room should have shouted "EVERYONE, COACH!"

    It's bush league, "midmajor" kind of mistakes. It's why Charlie is coaching in the AAC instead of the Power-5, and honestly, he probably won't be there much longer either. Tom got a reputation for big marbles by taking risks in his "midmajor" job, so why does he make all the wrong calls for us? The horrible 4th down attempts, the running with no chance of success... Jesus.

    I have a separate issue with Roach as a captain and how he basically cost us the game when ISU missed the first FG attempt. We have zero senior leadership, much like Strong's teams as well. This kind of goes back to a Mack problem with the type of players we were recruiting, and the game is different now. A couple of other posters have talked about the transfer portal and you can kind of take the temperature of a team midseason based on the activity around it. Texas' temperature is not hot, contrary to what Herman thinks the public needs to know about the team behind closed doors. People are correct that this is going to cost us.

    Although the injuries affect which personnel is on the field, I think most people can tell that even with 11 healthy guys, a lot of the scheming isn't going to fix stupid. ISU's first drive of each half showed that regular starters who haven't been bumped up the depth chart are flailing madly at their assignments. This is ALL coaching, not injuries.
     
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  17. ViperHorn

    ViperHorn 10,000+ Posts

    especially with Dicker the Kicker.
     
  18. moondog_LFZ

    moondog_LFZ 5,000+ Posts

    I would like to see more pistol formations where we can fake the run and pass.
     
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  19. Chop

    Chop 10,000+ Posts

    All of our offensive problems would be solved if we only ran more trick plays...

    Not the pistol, I mean actual trick plays. Remember that flea flicker to Colin Johnson. We certainly wouldn't be too predictable any more.

    :smokin::rolleyes1::smokin::rolleyes1::smokin::rolleyes1::smokin::rolleyes1::smokin::rolleyes1::smokin::rolleyes1::smokin::rolleyes1::smokin::rolleyes1::smokin::rolleyes1:
     
  20. MajesticII

    MajesticII 1,000+ Posts

    Remember 1996 ? With Ricky Williams in the backfield and only needing a yard....What did John Mackovic call ? ROLL LEFT !!!!! QB tosses to wide open TE. Texas upsets #1 Nebraska !!!! Herman would have gotten beat running up the gut against a defense bringing everyone to stop the run.
     
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  21. MajesticII

    MajesticII 1,000+ Posts

    Presser today : Herman's answer to a question...."We haven't coached it well enough." You make $5 million and your Coordinators make a million plus.....and you admit you didn't do your job ? SMDH... Next question should have been.. WHY THE HELL NOT ???
     
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    Last edited: Nov 18, 2019
  22. Austin_Bill

    Austin_Bill 2,500+ Posts

    Imagine a drinking game where we listen to Tom Herman press conference and every time he says something we don't like, we drink. After ISU, I think some of us would get their stomachs pumped.
     
  23. Run Pincher

    Run Pincher 2,500+ Posts

    That's actually pretty funny because I was thinking what we need here is Brown to Lewis, or at least a pitch back to the QB like we did against KSU. But if it works, don't expect to ever see it again.
     
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  24. ShAArk92

    ShAArk92 1,000+ Posts

    you're right ... that's why I'll be doing something else on Saturday afternoon. which will finish with a typically rescheduled holiday.

    I'm not calling for Herman's firing ... but he hasn't improved his ability to be the Head Coach at Texas. The search committee needs to be filled by the end of the CY and they need to spend 2020 looking & interviewing, ready to hire at the end of next season ... which is more than Charlie got from the day he set foot on the 40 acres.

    It's amazing how much damage a rabid aggy governor can do to a program he doesn't like.

    ... Oh ... don't count the number of conference championships Mack won in 16 years.

    The frustration was going from bad to worse.

    time for a hiatus.
     
  25. Sangre Naranjada

    Sangre Naranjada 10,000+ Posts

    The older I get, the easier it is to follow this advice. And on the other hand, I have less patience with the young'uns who can't follow it and feel that they must use social media to spew their frustrations to the world.
     
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  26. dukesteer

    dukesteer 5,000+ Posts

    Look, I don’t hate the guy but here’s something to think about. Name three things that Herman does well.

    Offensive play calling? Remember, Herman was considered an offensive genius when we hired him. His inability to adjust is stunning.

    Defense? Is it all on Orlando? And respectfully, please don’t talk about injuries or young players because last year, with upper classmen and players like Omenihu and Johnson, we had the same late game collapse issues. (Remember OU, OSU, WVA?)

    Special teams? Negatory.

    Clock management? I don’t think so.

    In-game decisions? Seriously?

    Game preparation? Not.

    Yes, I can name a few, stolen from a pay site:

    Recruiting
    Social Media
    Urine management

    So far Herman has been a massive disappointment and I’m not sure if he can grow quickly enough on the job to avoid a disaster. Let me add that a win this Saturday would equate to lifting the Rock of Gibraltar off his shoulders. I really hope for him — and us — that it happens because I can assure you that we are on the edge of a cliff, about to fall off.
     
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  27. horninchicago

    horninchicago 10,000+ Posts

    @dukesteer, we get it...you are on the fence about what he does well.

    :p
     
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  28. KBBAKER

    KBBAKER 500+ Posts

    There are a least 10 games in the Herman era that he "should have won". The best part about Tom Herman his that every game is competitive and close. Unfortunately, he is usually on the wrong side of the close games.
     
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  29. Statalyzer

    Statalyzer 10,000+ Posts

    And Rice. Not much to hang the hat on, I know, but let's be accurate.

    Disagree. We won that game because we played and coached better and there was nothing fluky about it. Heck, we may win by 20 if our punt returners can hold onto the ball.

    For some reason, we just went downhill from there. On defense the injuries explain 70%-80% of that, but the OL getting so much worse since then is baffling.

    This is baffling also, both in how dramatically it went from nigh-unstoppable to completely-ineffective, and how Herman and Beck still don't seem to realize that it's not working any more.

    As the biggest defender of the "use analytics and go for it on 4th down more" here, I completely agree with this decision. You always take the walk-off FG if it's that close-in, instead of giving the other team time to answer a score with a score of their own.
     
  30. rick mueller

    rick mueller Burnt Orange Bleeder

    Not unlike the "18 Wheeler" package. It started out brutally unstoppable. It became brutally ineffective.
     
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