Running into holder?

Discussion in 'On The Field' started by where_are_my_8s, Feb 1, 2009.

  1. where_are_my_8s

    where_are_my_8s 250+ Posts

    Why is that not a dead-ball penalty and enforced on the kickoff?
     
  2. alden

    alden 1,000+ Posts

    Because if you're obviously going to run him over, it's extra intimidation, pressuring him to make mistakes. They want to avoid situations where it's worth it to do penalties that can cause injuries.
     
  3. Squall

    Squall 500+ Posts

    Like James Harrison holding a guy down and punching him during a punt???

    if the ball leaves the foot, that should be it
     
  4. HatDaddy

    HatDaddy 1,000+ Posts

    turrble call..
     
  5. Hpslugga

    Hpslugga 2,500+ Posts

    ^
    No it isn't. It's a safety rule
     
  6. gasemitter

    gasemitter 100+ Posts


     
  7. naphan

    naphan 250+ Posts

    More like a tough break. He just lost his balance.
     
  8. Squall

    Squall 500+ Posts

    gasemitter - then again, why on the punt, when the ball is in the air, and the clock is still ticking, is the James Harrison personal foul call not called the same way??
     
  9. MadTrapper

    MadTrapper 100+ Posts


     
  10. buckhorn

    buckhorn 1,000+ Posts


     
  11. where_are_my_8s

    where_are_my_8s 250+ Posts

    By rule there is a certain amount of time that runs off the clock on any field goal attempt (I want to say 6 seconds).

    And I agree, if possession is over once the ball is punted, then a team attempting a FG loses possession once the ball is kicked.
     
  12. HatDaddy

    HatDaddy 1,000+ Posts


     
  13. TheContractor

    TheContractor 250+ Posts

    Great Call. Bad rule.
    Same as ruffing the passer.
     
  14. Hpslugga

    Hpslugga 2,500+ Posts


     
  15. ProdigalHorn

    ProdigalHorn 10,000+ Posts


     
  16. Hes not here

    Hes not here 100+ Posts

    If it's a personal foul to rough the kicker, it should be no different in regards to the holder. It's the exact same issue regarding safety. As far as whether it's a dead ball or not, as stated the play isn't over with therefore it shouldn't be enforced after the possession change. In Harrison's case the ball changes possession as soon as it leaves the punters foot, and his foul certainly occured after that.
     
  17. TexasTower

    TexasTower 500+ Posts

    I'm wondering where all the football idiots are coming from?? Is it people that don't know the rules or are there that many Steeler-hating Cowboy fans with sour grapes around??

    The call is the same as a personal foul roughing the passer or roughing the kicker penalty.

    It's a great rule. The holder is in the most prone position in the game. If it was assessed on the kickoff there'd be all kinds of guys just plowing the holder on his first kick... he wouldn't be focused the rest of the game.
     
  18. UTFanFromAZ

    UTFanFromAZ 250+ Posts

    TexasTower: Amen on your post about the Steeler-hating Cowboy Fans
     
  19. Hpslugga

    Hpslugga 2,500+ Posts


     
  20. VYFan

    VYFan 2,500+ Posts


     
  21. ImissWallyPryor

    ImissWallyPryor 1,000+ Posts

    And the reason the change of possession occurs when the ball leaves the punter's foot is because at that time, the receiving team is deemed to be blocking for the return and can then be called for illegal blocks. Even though the ball's in the air.
     
  22. Hornilicious

    Hornilicious < 25 Posts

    TexasTower-

    I agree with you about people not knowing the rules, but your "Steeler-hating Cowboy fans with sour grapes" comment makes no sense. The Steelers kicked another chip shot field goal after the penalty just the same as they did before the penalty. Why would a Cowboy fan give a crap either way?
     
  23. NJlonghorn

    NJlonghorn 2,500+ Posts

    I have always understood (with absolutely no basis other than observation) that the "after change of possession" distinction is more of a funcitonal concept than a timing concept. Consider two examples:

    (1) The punting team is called for holding a rusher who is trying to block the punt. The penalty is pre-kick because it functionally involves the block attempt, not the return -- even if the hold occurs after the ball hits the punters foot.

    (2) A return-team wideout is called for holding a coverage team wide-out. This penalty is post-kick because it functionally invovles the return, not the block attempt -- even if the hold occurs before the ball hits the punters foot.

    I could be wrong about one or both of these. I would appreciate comments from anyone who actually knows the rules.
     

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