2020 Senate & House

Discussion in 'West Mall' started by Joe Fan, May 5, 2019.

  1. Monahorns

    Monahorns 2,500+ Posts

    I agree but there is also a thing called nullification that is the right of states if they believe a law is unconstitutional. It isn't something you hear much about these days, but the founding generation talked about this right. Various states talked about it for the first 50-60 of the union.

    I don't know if there is a reasonable case to say e-verify is unconstitutional.
     
  2. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez 10,000+ Posts

    I'm familiar with the nullification doctrine. I'm generally a pro-states' rights guy, but I'm a pretty strong nullification skeptic for two reasons. First, I don't see much evidence that the Founding Fathers intended it at the time the Constitution was written. To my knowledge, though it was brought up early on, it was still after the Constitution was ratified.

    Second, it seems to conflict with or at least severely undermine some critical text of the Constitution, and even my support for states' rights takes a back seat to textualism. Nullification would effectively eliminate the judicial power clause that gives federal courts the power to decide all "Cases, in Law and Equity, arising under this Constitution, the Laws of the United States . . ." It would severely undermine the supremacy clause as well, because any state that doesn't like a federal law (even a constitutional one) could just nullify it.

    Having said that, from a policy standpoint, I would choose traditional nullification over what we have now, which is essentially federal nullification over state laws through the 14th Amendment. The Founders would undoubtedly advocate violent revolution to kill that garbage system off. It is a disgrace far more abusive than anything done by King George III or the British Parliament.

    The appropriate remedy for a federal government that abuses its power and violates the Constitution is secession. There is no constitutional prohibition against it (even after the Civil War), so under the Tenth Amendment, it is permissible. Hell, the United States' existence is dependent on the right of people to secede from an oppressive power.

    Certainly under current judicial interpretations, it isn't. However, even if we didn't have a judiciary bent heavily in favor of left wing federal activism, it would be pretty easy to constitutionally defend mandatory E-Verify.
     
  3. Monahorns

    Monahorns 2,500+ Posts

    I agree. But I think nullification could be a better, less disruptive alternative for States when something is very clearly unconstitutional.
     
  4. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez 10,000+ Posts

    In the short term, it might be less disruptive, but in the long term, you'd lose the rule of law at the federal level. Conservative states would nullify liberal federal laws, and liberal states would nullify conservative federal laws. Long term, I think you'd end up with a civil war anyway.

    Secession might be a more dramatic an disruptive move, but it doesn't have to lead to war. Agreements can be negotiated and reached. For example, if Scotland and the Welsh one day leave the UK, nobody thinks the Scots, Welsh, and the English would go to war. They'd likely negotiate a separation agreement that keeps the facets of the union that all parties like and dump the ones they fight over. Same thing could happen in the US.
     
  5. Monahorns

    Monahorns 2,500+ Posts

    No option has to lead in civil war. Nullification could cause the Federal government to be more circumspect about enacting unconstitutional law. Or it could lead to secession. No reason to link it to war.
     
  6. theiioftx

    theiioftx 2,500+ Posts

    Secession on both sides would be the answer. The libs would have the four corners - California, Washington State, New York, and Florida. Sprinkle in surrounding states in the NE, NW and West and you have the United States of Liberals. Minnesota becomes Somalia North.

    Every other state becomes the new USA.
     
  7. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    This seems cruel and unusual
    Their political fundraising includes the sale of baby merchandise
    [​IMG]
     
  8. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    Progress
     
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  9. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez 10,000+ Posts

    It doesn't have to lead to war. However, my worry is that nullification creates the illusion of fair play and good faith. The most ideological states will nullify federal laws they don't like but pretend that their nullification is a constitutional concern and then expect other states to respect federal power in other situations. I fear that will eventually boil over into violence when people figure out it was all BS.

    Secession solves that fraud, because the states can just become independent and write their own rules. There is no pretense of federal supremacy. If California wants to form a godless, socialist utopia with a permanent underclass of third world slave labor, they can just be honest about it and do it without it affecting the sane parts of the country.
     
  10. Monahorns

    Monahorns 2,500+ Posts

    It's logical. With many things the founders talked about, nullification was something to only be used in extreme cases by those who did honestly want to abide by the Constitution and play fair. But politicians today don't have the same demeanor towards law or the Constitution.

    I still support nullification. I still support secession. But also hope the USA can stay as it is, if possible.
     
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  11. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    Dems spent a ton on this Texas seat (Houston area) and the natl media are watching and hoping, but so far so good
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2020
  12. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez 10,000+ Posts

    The lead held. He beat her 58-42. Apparently multiple presidential candidate weighed in on the race, and Beta made flipping it a big priority after his campaign fizzled out. Link.

    What's noteworthy is that Gates wasn't a particularly strong candidate. However, he busted his ***. He worked very hard, and it paid off.
     
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    Last edited: Jan 29, 2020
  13. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    Female running in a suburban district. And they spent alot of money, including more Soros money down the drain
    [​IMG]
     
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    Last edited: Jan 29, 2020
  14. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    The NRSC and GOP are flipping out over Doug Collins' announcement for Senate.

    Loeffler was Governor Kemp's hand-picked Senator to replace Isakson who just retired. Other than the female part, Loeffler is a typical old school Rep pick, a big money donor to the Rs. Kemp personally went to DC to try and convince Trump about her. But Trump preferred Collins.

    Loeffler is wealthy and had donated a lot to campaigns, including at least one Democrat. She also had the bad sense to donate to Mitt Romney for Senate. Worse is that she is weak on immigration and abortion. This is part of why Kemp thought she would pull in the suburban Atlanta female vote. But my guess is that Collins will crush her since he is so closely tied to Trump (although Loeffler is much hotter than Collins). This matter shows there is still a huge gap between Senate Rs and Trump & his voting base.
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2020
  15. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    Speaking of "weak on immigration," someone made a list of them
    Cornyn is on it, not Cruz. Plus several on the House side from Texas
     
  16. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    Speaking of Beto, a short piece today about how far the Dem Party has sunk from RFK to RFO

    " ...... Nothing says more about the decline of the Democrats than the difference between the two Robert Francises — Robert F. Kennedy and Beto O’Rourke. They stand at the opposite ends of the sixty-year chasm between them. Beto was laid back and ephemeral; Bobby was intense. Bobby's swimming coach at Harvard called him “heavy in the water” — drownable, dense. Beto, by contrast, seemed light as a feather, as if even a strong breeze could blow him away.

    Beto was a dilettante who wafted his way through various interests; Bobby was knee-deep in vital concerns: crime and punishment; civil rights and segregation; aggressive communism vs. the West. It's quite a shock to realize that Beto today is four years older than Bobby was when he was murdered. Beto today looks like a young person, whereas Bobby looked like an old man.

    In his last campaign, when he drew the hysterical crowds some people today thought Beto’s resembled, people who covered Bobby were stunned by his looks. "The brown-blond hair was turning gray, and the once-boyish face was deeply lined," wrote Evan Thomas. Columnist Joe Kraft had “never seen him look so bad, so tired; his blue eyes were standing out really like a death’s head from his skull."

    Nobody needs a president to look quite that bad, but the unlined vacuity of some of these candidates seems at least as disturbing: a candidate needs a few lines on his visage or at least traces of thought. The lowering of the experience bar shows disrespect for the office and arrogance on the part of some of the candidates. Anyone bright enough to one day become president surely should understand that."

    The decline of the primaries. From RFK to Beto
     
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  17. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez 10,000+ Posts

    Because what we need most in a swing state is a primary fight and a divided party.
     
  18. Sangre Naranjada

    Sangre Naranjada Liquor Man

    I've decided to refer to him as BobFrank from here on out.
     
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  19. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    I suppose 'need' can be subjective but I would argue what the Senate needs is a lot more like Collins and a lot less like Loeffler, who is just another establishment-Republican, swamp-dweller. If you want things to change in DC or even just get marginally better, then it's an easy call.
     
  20. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    I wrote about OEMs/supply chains moving to Asia in this post above. About how Trump understood what was happening and was acting to stop it. Didnt get much response.
    But can you guess where the OEMs/supply chain for medical supplies is now?
    China
    Think about that situation in light of the coronavirus
    Who did this?
    The Globalists/Party of Davos
    We need to reverse this and it cannot happen soon enough
     
  21. 4th_floor

    4th_floor Grrrrrrrrr!

    So the runoff may not have turned out exactly the way they wanted? What part of 58% to 42% turned out the way they wanted? Does Beto understand that if voter registrations have to go up to achieve 42% in an oddly timed election, he has barely started the steep climb to get 50% in the general election. But math, or truth, has never been Beto's strong suit.
     
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  22. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    I guess the residency requirements are pretty lax but anyway Laura Ingraham is seriously toying with the idea of primarying Romney in Utah in 2024
     
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  23. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez 10,000+ Posts

    It's a stupid idea. She's not a Mormon and has no connections to the state. If they really want to take him out, they'll have to find another Mike Lee.
     
  24. nashhorn

    nashhorn 2,500+ Posts

    I think it’s just a joke.
     
  25. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    She has considered running in the past - for something, I cant rmbr what
     
  26. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    I think she is an observant Catholic
     
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  27. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

     
    • Funny Funny x 5
  28. theiioftx

    theiioftx 2,500+ Posts

    The Bee is on fire today. Several great posts.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  29. Monahorns

    Monahorns 2,500+ Posts

    The Bee should be ashamed of their anti-South statements. Don't they know their market?
     
  30. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    I thought they should have gone with Arkansas
     
    • Agree Agree x 3

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