Coronavirus

Discussion in 'West Mall' started by Clean, Jan 28, 2020.

  1. Musburger1

    Musburger1 2,500+ Posts

    Based on data out of Israel and the UK, yes, wildly inaccurate.
     
  2. OUBubba

    OUBubba Reluctant and Bullied Sponsor

    Yale Medicine: Comparing the COVID-19 Vaccines: How Are They Different?

    We all agree that Pfizer is the weakest against the variants. 6 months in, 97% efficacy against severe disease. Still 90% effective against the delta variant IN MOTHER SCRATCHING ISRAEL and 96% effective against hospitalization in THE UNITED KINGDOM.

    I'd say your assertions are wildly inaccurate.
     
  3. mb227

    mb227 5,000+ Posts

    As relates to the sniffles, yes.

    You asked a question earlier and were given an answer. You now want to play word games. The sniffles vaccine does not accomplish the stated goal. Further, in some cases, it appears to have the very real potential of hastening a demise.
     
  4. OUBubba

    OUBubba Reluctant and Bullied Sponsor

    As it relates to HOSPITALIZATION and DEATH, it is very effective. As it relates to the sniffles and flu symptoms, not as effective. But, you know this and are just being contrarian. It's your nature. FREEDOM!!!!!
     
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  5. Garmel

    Garmel 5,000+ Posts

    Hmm. With 50% of the ICUs in Israel being occupied by vaccinated folks I'll take that "90% against severe disease" number as being too high.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. Musburger1

    Musburger1 2,500+ Posts

    In the short term - a few months - the shot does provide additional antibodies which helps protect against the virus; at least the Wuhan strain. But clearly the effect isn't long-lasting, hence the need for continual "boosters," and it doesn't do too much against mutated strains which will be ongoing.

    But your focus, and the focus on the news, is on whether or not the shot is effective in fighting Covid. For. the sake of argument, let's say it is. What are you missing?

    More than a few scientists are very concerned that the Spike proteins generated by your body as a result of the vaccination will have long term consequences including the weakening of your immune system as well as damage to various organs. In other words, you may not catch Covid - but you instead die of some other complication that your innate immune system would have easily handles (cancer, heart problems, clotting, etc.). Many highly vaccinated places are starting too show an excess amount of deaths from other causes. For example, you might expect 1000 heart failures in a month, but now there are 1,200. Is this tied to vaccinations? It's probably too early to tell. Until time passes and more data is unearthed, we don't know.

    If you are "fully vaccinated" (no such thing since you have to keep pumping in booster shots to stay protected, even though you can still catch it), and you have no concerns, keep taking booster shots whenever Team Biden advises you. Me. No thank you.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 19, 2021
  7. Monahorns

    Monahorns 5,000+ Posts

    Unfortunately I think you are right.

    And if change is made, the whole idea of Social Contract needs to be thrown in the dustbin of history. A totally useless and meaningless doctrine that had lead to much suffering in the world.
     
  8. Monahorns

    Monahorns 5,000+ Posts

    The 90% against severe disease sounds good but isn't the human immune system at 95% without the vaccine? The hospitalization rate of unvaccinated is around 5%.
     
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  9. Garmel

    Garmel 5,000+ Posts

    That I don't know.
     
  10. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    The CDC is clearly tracking the vaccinated death/sickness impact vs. unvaccinated. With VERS they've been public about monitoring any symptoms from vacc and with the FDA review of Booster shots they've clearly been monitoring efficacy and longevity of the antibodies for the vaccines.

    To be sure, there is an army of people with actual medical degrees pouring over the data. I can only imagine that the amateur internet doctors looking over their shoulder and claiming they aren't interested in something they are clearly monitoring must be a bit grating for them.
     
  11. Musburger1

    Musburger1 2,500+ Posts

    By social contract, I not only mean the ponzi schemes such as Social Security and Medicare, welfare, and so forth, but also the idea that if you work hard and follow the rules you will have a fair shot at upward mobility under the law. The former is unsustainable because its a math problem. The latter happens when corruption controls the rails of government. We are beginning to see both begin to converge in my opinion.
     
  12. Musburger1

    Musburger1 2,500+ Posts

    There are a great number of nurses and doctors who have stated that the ability to report under VAERS has been discouraged/suppressed. So don't trust every statistic since statistics are only as reliable as the data available for input.
     
  13. OUBubba

    OUBubba Reluctant and Bullied Sponsor

    I'm sure Yale is inaccurate. I'd be interested in your link. Here's the closest I could find: Number of COVID patients on ventilators hits highest level since March

    "The vast majority of both new infections and serious cases have been among those who are not vaccinated. According to the ministry, 493 of those in serious condition were unvaccinated, compared with 134 patients who were vaccinated with two doses, and 55 patients who received a third dose of the coronavirus vaccine."
     
  14. OUBubba

    OUBubba Reluctant and Bullied Sponsor

    I'm in healthcare. Inputing VAERS data is actually the wild west. Anyone can do it. Due to that freedom it's not great data, is inaccurate, and is prone to overreporting. Our system has done about 20,000 doses and the only one that I thought we had we determined after the fact that she was trying to get out of work so it wasn't relevant. Unverified reports of vaccine side effects in VAERS aren't the smoking guns portrayed by right-wing media outlets – they can offer insight into vaccine hesitancy

    Damn, the lamestream media thinks of everything.
     
  15. Horn2RunAgain

    Horn2RunAgain 1,000+ Posts

    So now you're down to posting medical links authored by Political Science "assistant professors". Hard to take you seriously
     
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  16. mb227

    mb227 5,000+ Posts

    Even worse than that was the complete failure of the author of what amounts to an opinion piece to even consider WHY the 'mainstream' sites (which seem to be those with whom the author agrees) might have an agenda to suppress some bad information that ran contrary to the narrative being shoveled.
     
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  17. OUBubba

    OUBubba Reluctant and Bullied Sponsor

    It actually discusses, from a social science point of view, that the simplistic nature of the VAERS data has been manipulated to create vaccine hesitancy. But, sure.
     
  18. mb227

    mb227 5,000+ Posts

    [​IMG]
     
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  19. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez Beer Prophet

    It protects the right to assemble and private property rights. However, a temporary restriction on a business from operating isn't going to be deemed a taking of property. (Is there a point at which it could be? I think the argument can certainly be made.) It's going to be a restriction on the time, place, and manner in which private property is used. We impose restrictions like that all the time. If we didn't, then there would be nothing such as zoning laws, noise ordinances, etc.

    There can also be restrictions on the time, place, and manner in which people assemble. If you want to assemble 4,000 people in the gallery of the Texas House, you'll be stopped.

    You're going to hate this, but no constitutional right is absolute and subject to no regulation. That sounds terrible, but it's true, and it has always been true.

    I don't necessarily disagree. I think Abbott should have called the Legislature into session before imposing lockdowns to clarify his authority on the matter, but the laws on point are loose by design.

    However, I also understand the other side of things. It would have taken a lot of time to convene the Legislature and pass a new statute, and he didn't act in clear and direct conflict with it. Furthermore, at the time we weren't totally sure what we were dealing with. Fortunately, we now know a lot more about how to deal with Covid, but at the time, we didn't. If he hadn't acted and the virus had been what we feared it was and thousands of children had died, Abbott's balls would have been in a sling.
     
  20. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    The most high profile termination to date for choosing to not get vaccinated? Kyrie Irving may be giving Rolo a run for his money.

    Washington State football coach Nick Rolovich fired: How it happened, what comes next and more

    Dude walked away from a $3.2M/yr contract. 4 assistants were also let go.

    He seemed like a nice enough guy. He was the only P12 head coach not to be vaccinated. He applied for a Religious exemption, no word yet on whether that was accepted/rejected. That's not a guarantee though because accommodations still need to be made to not be in close proximity to the public. That's not possible with an HC. Empathetic to the players and the remaining coaches that chose to get vaccinated but will likely lose their jobs under a new staff. Rolo...not so much. As the highest paid State of Washington employee there is an inherent expectation that you lead. The direction he's leading goes against the social contract. Buh bye.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 19, 2021
  21. mb227

    mb227 5,000+ Posts

    Rolovich is going to be fine, as will the assistants who follow him to a private school that will open their checkbook to the group. And so will the players who head to the portal, given the number of players that typically choose programs based upon who the coaches are...

    Ironically, looking at football, Arizona Cardinals just single-teamedly showed how useless mandates are given that the head coach, GM, and several players were unavailable last week due to...'rona -team is fully vaxxed.
     
  22. Garmel

    Garmel 5,000+ Posts

    From a few months ago.
     
  23. Monahorns

    Monahorns 5,000+ Posts

    We are not talking about constitutional rights. We are talking about natural, God-given, inalienable rights. The fact that governments give reasons why they can violate them doesn't justify the violations. It shows how bad governments are and how well brain washed our citizenry is to allow it.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 19, 2021
  24. Musburger1

    Musburger1 2,500+ Posts

    The elephant in the room is the fact that the shot neither prevents you from being infected nor from spreading the infection. Everyone is expected to ignore that.
     
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  25. mb227

    mb227 5,000+ Posts

    A recent obit from Oregon actually cited the vaccine induced thrombosis...

    Jessica Berg Wilson Obituary (1983 - 2021) The Oregonian
     
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  26. horninchicago

    horninchicago 10,000+ Posts

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  27. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    If you care about the incidence of VITT, it's occurrence in vaccine recipients this is a good article from the American College of Cardiology.

    Note that VITT has only been tied to AstraZeneca and J&J. As of early September ~14M had received the J&J vaccine in the US. That would equate to ~13 people having this issue and it isn't always always fatal. Of course, VITT occurs at a much greater rate for those hospitalized with Covid-19.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2021
  28. Musburger1

    Musburger1 2,500+ Posts

    I read the obituary. The author’s anger came through when describing the deceased succumbing to the pressure of a forced vaccination. It made me angry too.
     
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  29. OUBubba

    OUBubba Reluctant and Bullied Sponsor

    Glad to see you Brent. Seriously. The posters here are a patterned quilt.
     
  30. horninchicago

    horninchicago 10,000+ Posts

    Go on...

    And, who told you his first name?

    :ousucksnana: <---not really, you bastage.
     

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