Grading the Team's Performance-Week 4

Discussion in 'On The Field' started by Hpslugga, Sep 30, 2017.

  1. Hpslugga

    Hpslugga 2,500+ Posts

    [​IMG]

    Let me call everyone's attention to something that's already obvious:

    The offensive penalties.

    Look, we're not a big play team. We don't have superstars. When you don't have superstars, your offensive success depends entirely on 2 things, both of which usually go hand-in-hand: Line play and staying ahead of the count.

    Our OL is utter **** right now, and one of the reasons is that they commit holding penalties like it's going out of style. Go to TexasSports.com and read the Play by Play section of the game stats and Find the word "holding." It comes up 5 different times for UT's offense, almost all of which were on first down. When that happens, you're instantly (and tremendously) behind the count. "Ahead of the count" means you're gaining 3.3 yards per play on average inside any given series. We want, at the very worst, 2nd and 6, 3rd and 3, etc. When an offense with this few play-makers gets behind 2nd and 17, 3rd and 12, etc, we're ******* punting or we're throwing a stupid INT on 3rd down.

    Here's another thing for the people who thing coaching is a matter of plugging in players and managing it so tightly as to resemble a video gamer playing NCAA 2014: there isn't a play arsenal for 3rd and 12 with these types of players.

    You run a play and hope your guys can break a tackle or five, but you also live in the real world and you're really just running safe **** in preparation for a punt/FG attempt. The 2008 team had much better skill players than this, but they weren't particularly earth-shattering. What made them so great was the OL's ability to stay ahead of the count and to use that against the defense in order to create a long drive and/or a huge play. Defenses never want to face a 2nd and 1 because 1) the offense has 3 opportunities to get a first down from, presumably, a yard away and 2) the offensive coordinators these days tend to call play-action passes in those situations and then your DB's are in a world of **** because your LB's, by their very base instincts, are going to bite on just about any good run fake.

    I went ahead and did a quick calculation.

    In 2008, the OL combined for 11 penalties in the first 4 games
    In 2017, the OL has combined for 21 penalties in the first 4 games

    When you don't have a WR corps of Shipley, Cosby, Collins, an RB like Ogbonnaya and a QB like McCoy, those penalties become all the more crucial. That 2008 team still would have been fantastic even if those numbers were reversed because they had an OL and a skill players set that could overcome them. We don't have those. What we have are guys who commit holding and false start penalties like the ****'s gonna rot. It's been said that TV character MacGuyver could "make a bomb out of a rubber band, a pen and a paper clip" or something to that effect. That's what we're asking of Shane Buechelle and Sam Ehlinger. But they can't do that when the rubber band frequently snaps

    It basically comes out like this:

    We average 14 possessions per game, which means we average 3-4 possessions per quarter. We also average 1 offensive penalty per quarter. Virtually every penalty has killed a drive, so we're killing 25-33% of our drives every quarter with false start and holding penalties. With an offense that punts more often than it scores TD's, 17 against ISU should not surprise anyone.
     
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  2. LousianaHorn

    LousianaHorn Kabong

    And HP as a former lineman the reason you hold is that you are getting your *** whipped.........we gotta alot of guys playing that when August rolled around were 2 and 3 on the depth chart.....that usually aint good.
     
  3. El Sapo

    El Sapo Bevo's BFF

    But hey, defense sure is playing better :hookem:
     
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  4. Hpslugga

    Hpslugga 2,500+ Posts

    Oh there's no doubt they hold out of desperation. I guess my whole point was that Charlie Strong's comment about the "cake's been baked" was utter *********, unless of course he was speaking of yellow cake.
     
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  5. X Misn Tx

    X Misn Tx 2,500+ Posts

    Charlie would be bummed about this OL depth chart also. Delance and the injuries would have any coach abandoning his cake metaphors.
     
  6. 806 Horn

    806 Horn 25+ Posts

    So what should the offensive coaching staff be doing to counter the OL being in the shape it's in?? Types of plays or schemes that work better?

    Another question for HP...your thoughts on when we go 5-wide but one those 5 is either Warren or Porter?
     
  7. Hpslugga

    Hpslugga 2,500+ Posts

    Run the packages that best resemble the scheme that was designed by my avatar.

    Seriously, because that had an ethos and it was built around the premise that "we don't have a powerful offensive line and it's more natural to a passer to throw on the run anyways."

    I wouldn't say run it to a T (we're a shotgun team and that's actually an under center offense, but it's all translatable).

    1. Go at the quickest tempo you can run the offense at
    2. Spread the field as much as you can (doing this and the former forces the D to reveal coverages and limits their ability to substitute)
    3. Move the pocket at least half the time when you throw
    4. Use motion to force secondaries to reveal man/zone
    5. Use same blocking on at least half your passes (meaning you're blocking the same on passes and runs half the time)
    6. Use different option looks

    Those are the best things you can do to overcome a bad OL, and even then you still might fail (our WR depth is tremendously shallow).

    And honestly, our offense is at a point where not only would I as the HC opt to do such a thing, I'd do it with Jerrod Heard at QB. He's not gonna replicate VY, but he's elusive, he's explosive, he can throw the ball downfield, he can throw on the run and he most definitely can run the option from the spread. I'm not gonna say that making such a shift would get us up to being able to **** out 35 on ISU, but it's the best shot we have with the cards we've been dealt.
    Meeeeeeh
     
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  8. ViperHorn

    ViperHorn 10,000+ Posts

    A couple of questions HP:
    * Can the OL go up to at least "stabilized" by next season? Nothing great, but cut down the holding penalties without Williams (who goes pro) or does the staff need to change their offensive philosophy now to set up for next season?

    * Would you advise M. Jefferson to go pro or stay another year to season?
     
  9. Chinstrap

    Chinstrap 1,000+ Posts

    I wondered why they did not use Heard more in run or pass options when facing that three man rush. Could not see much of their coverage but obviously it was a lot of double cover and with a few deep routes something underneath could work. A little pitch and run.

    Heard used to be a pretty good runner and he brings a decent short passing game. Until this line situation gets fixed, something needs to be done. Heard had some pretty good games at one time. He could also be very effectve on a QB draw.

    I have always been a big fan of run or pass options.
     
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    Last edited: Sep 30, 2017
  10. Dionysus

    Dionysus Idoit Admin

    Seems to me that Heard provides more options to threaten the defense. He doesn’t have the long ball touch like Buechele but he can make something happen when the OL is a liability.
     
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  11. Pomspoms

    Pomspoms 5,000+ Posts

    I disagree with your assessment about our receivers. We are deep there we are just not using them properly.
     
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  12. rick mueller

    rick mueller Burnt Orange Bleeder

    Not disagreeing with anything HP is saying, but at least a couple of those holds may have saved Boo's life. Still he ended up with an ankle sprain and a lick to his non-throwing shoulder. If things don't improve soon, no way he stays in the game much.
     
  13. rick mueller

    rick mueller Burnt Orange Bleeder

    I wonder if there has been any thought of moving Tope Imade back to o-line and does he offer an upgrade? My guess is "no" on both counts.
     
  14. Hpslugga

    Hpslugga 2,500+ Posts

    How would you use them?

    I'm being serious, not being a smartass. Because as I see it, this system is extremely friendly to the WR's due to being so run-centric (in theory at least) in such a vast set of spread formations. It affords them 1-on-1 opportunities a countless number of times, and I just do not see it in them. They don't separate very well consistently, they have made crucial drops and I've seen both Shane and Sam miss them so badly as to believe that there was a miscommunication and it has to be the WR's because there's no way 2 QB's read the defense that equally bad.
     
  15. mb227

    mb227 de Plorable

    Wait, so now even the cake has to pass a pee test? Damn...that's rough.
     
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  16. Pomspoms

    Pomspoms 5,000+ Posts

    I know this sounds simplistic and I'm blaming someone else but I have seen our receivers make fantastic catches. I just don't think our receivers are coached up well they don't run crisp routes like they should be taught. Where are the crossing routes like Brady likes to throw and the out and ups. (maybe they spend too much time practicing those sideline throws) So the scheme seems off. How bout receivers clearing out one side by going deep and then having a receiver come across the field to an open flat for about 5, 8, 12 yards and he should be wide open with his speed if he makes just a little move to the outside and then goes across. I just think there could be a better scheme for the receivers because I know they are fast enough. I know our slot receivers are fast enough. Also I don't remember any deep throws like 40 or 50 yards down the field that would stretch the defense so that I receivers could get open on the medium routes. Sometimes I think the coaches overthink things and they will say to themselves well we can't do this because of this, we can't do that because we don't do that well, so they just become close minded and narrow-minded. I think it's coaching not the lack of ability by the receivers. We totally underuse Duvernay, mapps and Johnson. Coaches need to loosen up and let them have fun. It's like when coaches bottled up VY, the offense was somewhat sluggish till the coaches trusted VY let him do his thang.
     
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  17. Hoop

    Hoop 500+ Posts

    I agree with this. Our receivers are as talented as Shipley, Cosby, Collins and we have more depth, as well. Our issues are at the QB position and the O-Line.
     
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    Last edited: Sep 30, 2017
  18. Chinstrap

    Chinstrap 1,000+ Posts

    Of course you are right about about the physical talent and depth. But what Hpslugga was pointing out was that getting open and helping the quarterback may be a problem. Running great routes and having great hands is irrelevant if you are not creating enough space between you and the cover man to allow the quarterback to throw to you.

    If you watched the Tech game last night the commentator talked about the loss of the best Tech receiver. His comment was on the loss of the best receiver who had the ability to get open in space. Against Iowa State, Johnson came back towards Buchelle to help him with a place to throw. It is hard to see the routes on tv but I too have wondered if part of the problem is with receivers not working with the quarterback. This takes joint communication. Ship and Colt did this very well. And for you old goats, remember the duo of Ray Berry and Johnny Unitas. Berry was not the best athlete on the field, nor the fastest, and I think he even had bad eyesight, but those two could wear a defense out.

    There needs to be one or more “go to” receivers who can run good routes, have good hands AND can get open. I think that is the assumption by Hpslugga of a potential problem. Unfortunately some of this skill may be natural and takes time between the quarterback and and receivers to develop.
     
  19. ViperHorn

    ViperHorn 10,000+ Posts

    Disagree with everything except depth (bodies not talent) and the OL issue. Shipley, Cosby, Collins have forgotten more about receiving than any receiver on the current team. Receiver quality is knowing how to get open and catching the ball. The current receivers appear to know nothing about these two qualities.

    The OL line is so bad no firm judgement can be made about the QB's (and RB"s for that matter). HP is correct - a coaching failure for not changing the "system" to fit the talent.
     
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  20. horninchicago

    horninchicago 10,000+ Posts

    I said the same during the game. They couldn't get open when Boo had all day to throw.
     
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  21. Chinstrap

    Chinstrap 1,000+ Posts

  22. dukesteer

    dukesteer 5,000+ Posts

    Viper, I vehemently disagree. Not to take anything away from those receivers but, they were made effective by a well devised scheme, and a pinpoint passer. In other words, the scheme and McCoy made Shipley, Cosby and Collins excellent receivers and, in turn, they helped make McCoy what he was at Texas.

    I simply don't buy the argument that we are lacking talent at the WR position today. In fact, one to six or more, this just might be the most talented group I can remember, and that includes Williams, Thomas, and Johnson, Sauer and Lammons, and the McCoy trio.

    Johnson, Foreman, Devernay, Heard, Humphrey, Hemphill- Mapps, Joe, Leonard, Burt... Folks, we are looking at an embarrassment of riches. When we learn to use them more effectively this offense will start to rack up the points, and the running game will prosper as well. It's going to happen.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 1, 2017
  23. LousianaHorn

    LousianaHorn Kabong

    Maynard never played for the Horns......Texas Western (UTEP).
     
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  24. dukesteer

    dukesteer 5,000+ Posts

    You're right. Meant to say Pete Lammons. Both he and Sauer played in the NFL.

    (I corrected my post.)
     
  25. Pomspoms

    Pomspoms 5,000+ Posts

    I kinda disagree with one of your statements. (not to split hairs) You stated that Johnson came back helping out with Boo but in reality Boo saw Johnson standing there and threw the ball into such a place that only Johnson can catch so he threw the ball to a place where it was leading Johnson to get open so it was really more boo creating that play I remember seeing the replay so Boo lead him open and Johnson attacked the ball coming back three or four steps, good play on ball but I think that Boo should get the most credit there for a successful play. Just sayin. That's a little sandlot ball. That's the way I see it.
     
  26. ViperHorn

    ViperHorn 10,000+ Posts

    I guess we will have to disagree Dukesteer. The current crop has no idea what they are doing (running a pattern isn't receiving) and continue struggle to catch the ball.
     
  27. beijinghorn1

    beijinghorn1 500+ Posts

    I think there is one really special player at the WR position and he would greatly improve the others because he is a tremendous deep threat and would require lots of attention, but it appears that he can not catch and I do not think that he has played this season.
     
  28. Dionysus

    Dionysus Idoit Admin

    Collin Johnson clearly qualifies as a special player, arguably our best WR. Are you referring to Burt?
     
  29. beijinghorn1

    beijinghorn1 500+ Posts

    Yes. I think Johnson is an Alvin Harper or Chris Carter type. I think he would be really special next to a great one, but I do not find him to be really special without someone else occupying the safeties. I do not want to short change Johnson...
     
  30. Hoop

    Hoop 500+ Posts

    I agree with this. I mean, it's easy to blame the O-line. People have done it for years, but this year the O-line is definitely struggling (injuries and depth are not helping). We also have two young QBs. The good news is that, by and large, most of these kids are young and should improve.

    Coach Herman brought up personnel in post game interviews basically saying they want to ensure that have people in the right place to be successful. He mentioned the struggles in the running game and the fact that we wouldn't be a team that throws the ball 70% of the time despite our talented receivers (and QBs).
     

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