'I Feel Duped on Climate Change'

Discussion in 'West Mall' started by Namewithheld, Feb 9, 2012.

  1. mchammer

    mchammer 10,000+ Posts

    It might have been excluded in order to get the paper published. Disproving the climate models is the first step since they have many problems. The cosmic ray theory is just one natural means of temperature variability. There are likely others that the models don’t consider.
     
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  2. bystander

    bystander 10,000+ Posts

    AWESOME SAUCE!
     
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  3. bystander

    bystander 10,000+ Posts

    From the cheap seats:

    1) Climate change - wealth redistribution and a gold-mine for virtue signaling rhetoric
    2) Reparations
    3) Forgiveness of student loan debt
    4) Open borders - benefits and voting rights in California increasing the population for a census thus gaining more electoral college votes
    5) Socialism in general as a catch-all

    This is the platform I see from the Left; fueled by "big-hearted" candidates such as Mr. O'Rourke and anger by AOC, Kamala etc. Climate change is the end-game to exploit.
     
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  4. iatrogenic

    iatrogenic 2,500+ Posts

    Add $1,000 for every citizen, $100 billion for housing black folks, and harnessing love.
     
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  5. Statalyzer

    Statalyzer 10,000+ Posts

    Is it just me, or is that a really big and obvious thing to overlook?
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  6. mchammer

    mchammer 10,000+ Posts

    Unless higher CO2 causes more warming which causes more convection and cloud formation. Even in that scenario, the impact of CO2 is self-limiting (dampening effect) and which the models do not accurately model.
     
  7. Monahorns

    Monahorns 5,000+ Posts

    The models have never even been verified. Several climate scientists have tried to publish papers analyzing the error of them, but no journal will do it. The models have propagating error issues that no one will talk about much less attempt to correct.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. OUBubba

    OUBubba 5,000+ Posts

    I think the sun's variability is 85% of climate variance. The mini Ice Age is my "proof". That said, I think we need to keep the earth "healthy" to be able to adapt is the Good Lord designed it.

    While I'm not necessarily a fan of paying off student debt it's no more socialist than the Trump tax cuts for the wealthy that took place and exploded the deficit that you guys hold so dear during Democratic presidential terms.
     
  9. mchammer

    mchammer 10,000+ Posts

    Revenue went up even after the tax cuts. The issue is on the spending side, which I blame both parties.
     
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  10. OUBubba

    OUBubba 5,000+ Posts

  11. OUBubba

    OUBubba 5,000+ Posts

  12. iatrogenic

    iatrogenic 2,500+ Posts

    Actual Tax revenues:

    2016-3.27 trillion
    2017-3.33 trillion
    2018-3.44 trillion

    Damn tax cuts!
     
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  13. mchammer

    mchammer 10,000+ Posts

    • Agree Agree x 2
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2019
  14. mchammer

    mchammer 10,000+ Posts

    Running higher in 2019
     
  15. mchammer

    mchammer 10,000+ Posts

  16. UTChE96

    UTChE96 2,500+ Posts

    Math is hard.
     
  17. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    Revenue goes up as a factor of a larger economy. A recession is just about the only thing to impact tax revenue growth. As you stated, the spending is out of control and that's a bi-partisan problem. It's ludicrous that we'll have a record $1T deficit this year with the economy as strong as it is.

    Federal Tax revenue by fiscal year. As an aside, 86% of this revenue is through income and payroll taxes. Corporations have dropped to a modern day low of 7% of the tax revenue pie.
    • FY 2020 - $3.64 trillion, budgeted.
    • FY 2019 - $3.44 trillion, estimated.
    • FY 2018 - $3.33 trillion.
    • FY 2017 - $3.32 trillion.
    • FY 2016 - $3.27 trillion.
    • FY 2015 - $3.25 trillion.
    • FY 2014 - $3.02 trillion.
    • FY 2013 - $2.77 trillion.
    • FY 2012 - $2.45 trillion.
    • FY 2011 - $2.30 trillion.
    • FY 2010 - $2.16 trillion.
    • FY 2009 - $2.10 trillion.
    • FY 2008 - $2.52 trillion.
    • FY 2007 - $2.57 trillion.
    • FY 2006 - $2.4 trillion.
    • FY 2005 - $2.15 trillion.
    • FY 2004 - $1.88 trillion.
    • FY 2003 - $1.72 trillion.
    • FY 2002 - $1.85 trillion.
    • FY 2001 - $1.99 trillion.
    • FY 2000 - $2.03 trillion.
    • FY 1999 - $1.82 trillion.
    • FY 1998 - $1.72 trillion.
    • FY 1997 - $1.58 trillion.
    • FY 1996 - $1.45 trillion.
    • FY 1995 - $1.35 trillion.
    • FY 1994 - $1.26 trillion.
    • FY 1993 - $1.15 trillion.
    • FY 1992 - $1.09 trillion.
    • FY 1991 - $1.05 trillion.
    • FY 1990 - $1.03 trillion.
    • FY 1989 - $991 billion.
    • FY 1988 - $909 billion.
    • FY 1987 - $854 billion.
    • FY 1986 - $769 billion.
    • FY 1985 - $734 billion.
    • FY 1984 - $666 billion.
    • FY 1983 - $601 billion.
    • FY 1982 - $618 billion.
    • FY 1981 - $599 billion.
    • FY 1980 - $517 billion.
     
  18. mchammer

    mchammer 10,000+ Posts

    Revenue doubled in the last 18 years, meaning an average growth rate of 4%. Clearly the problem is spending.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  19. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    With a $20T+ debt it's pretty clear they are BOTH the problem.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  20. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez Beer Prophet

    Spending is the problem, but there is something about the revenue that's worth noting. It has gone up but not as fast as it used to. Prior to 2000, it approximately doubled every ten years, and that trend has existed essentially since WWII. I'm not entirely sure what the cause of that is. I don't think it's tax rates being too low, because rates were lower in the '80s, and revenue still doubled. Obviously the Great Recession hit revenue very hard, but even before that, we weren't on a pace to double revenue.
     
  21. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    The size of our economy is so large that US Real GDP Growth Rate has slowed. The tax cuts aren't helping but I think it's a size issue.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  22. LongestHorn

    LongestHorn 2,500+ Posts

    fify
     
  23. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez Beer Prophet

    This is probably the biggest factor. Low inflation for the last several decades is also probably part of it. I noticed that revenue skyrocketed in the '70s (much more than doubling). Obviously I'd rather have low inflation than artificially high tax revenue, but it almost surely is a side effect of the low inflation.
     
  24. UTChE96

    UTChE96 2,500+ Posts

    That's a bizarre point that I have heard mentioned by other liberals as if it's a bad thing. We specifically slashed the corporate tax rate and therefore tax burden to encourage domestic growth and job creation. The trade-off for less revenue from corporations was the additional revenue from new jobs and an expanding economy over the long-term. I do agree that the growth of revenue always slows in the short-term after a tax cut but over time the economic growth compensates.

    P.S. I don't know who is responsible but congrats to whoever hijacked this thread.
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2019
  25. Sangre Naranjada

    Sangre Naranjada 10,000+ Posts

    Maybe this groundbreaking scientific revelation will help restore the thread to its original arc.
     
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  26. iatrogenic

    iatrogenic 2,500+ Posts

    I see that the article quotes OUBubba too:

    "That makes sense, because it's usually hotter when that [star] is up in the air," said Stillwater, OK resident Asher Arps, 31, speaking to reporters as temperature rose to 110 degrees over the weekend. "I knew it lit things up, of course, but I didn't realize it could make things hot."

    "The big star heats the earth, and the moon cools it—I get it," he added.
     
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  27. Statalyzer

    Statalyzer 10,000+ Posts

  28. iatrogenic

    iatrogenic 2,500+ Posts

    Party Pooper!
     
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  29. 4th_floor

    4th_floor Dude, where's my laptop?

    Using actual numbers is not fair, you bully!
     
  30. Sangre Naranjada

    Sangre Naranjada 10,000+ Posts

    He's not a bully, he's obviously racist.
     
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