'I Feel Duped on Climate Change'

Discussion in 'West Mall' started by Namewithheld, Feb 9, 2012.

  1. mchammer

    mchammer 5,000+ Posts

    The health impacts due to PM 2.5 is junk science. Based on secret science not peer reviewed.
     
  2. Monahorns

    Monahorns 2,500+ Posts

    The studies use data that aren't made public. It's all science performed poorly, hidden, and if ever found out protected from accountability.

    Read my comment more closely. I wasn't talking about the obsolescence of coal.

    I was talking about the necessary effect when you destroy capital. It impoverishes the society. Capital destruction is a factor to wage stagnation. I am not claiming it is the largest, but it is a factor.
     
  3. Monahorns

    Monahorns 2,500+ Posts

    Deez. Don't accept the false narrative. It doesn't help. People aren't dieing from air pollution which was a result of burning coal in a power plant.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. Monahorns

    Monahorns 2,500+ Posts

    Mchammer, I just learned about PM2.5!j Cool to see you on board and ahead of me.
     
  5. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez 10,000+ Posts

    I'm very suspicious of that study. I can accept that air pollution at high levels can cause health problems. However, I have a very hard time believing that there is real causation established between coal use and the €43 billion figure. I highly suspect that a lot of the treatment that they're blaming on coal should actually be blamed on rampant cigarette smoking. I can't disapprove it though.

    My point is that even if the study is rock solid, the remedy isn't what the environmentalist crackpots advocate. Germany largely adopted the crackpots' agenda to an extreme degree, and it's not working. They're having to boost their coal use literally just to keep the lights on, which should supposedly make this health problem (if real) worse.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. Monahorns

    Monahorns 2,500+ Posts

    Yeah. I read that the studies where they studied air pollution affects on health were based on amounts of PM2.5 in the air. Smoking one cigarette exposed a person to 10,000 times more PM2.5 than the air where coal plants exist.

    The EPA actually tried to trigger asmatics by exposing them to huge concentrations of PM2.5. It was still less than a cigarette. It didn't have any affect. But it shows how unethical the EPA is. They are willing to expose people to what they think is a harmful material just to prove their point.
     
  7. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez 10,000+ Posts

    And of course, the EPA is far more ethical and far more accountable than the environmental regulators in Europe. The EPA at least theoretically is limited by an enabling statute and can be taken to federal court. By comparison, EU regulators are kings on thrones.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  8. Monahorns

    Monahorns 2,500+ Posts

    Just wanted to add a tweet here that shows how closely linked labor productivity is to wages. When you destroy capital you are decreasing overall productivity in the economy. Good news of this graph is that even with our foolishness, things are still improving.

     
  9. Statalyzer

    Statalyzer 10,000+ Posts

    Granted "Yeah but it probably didn't outright kill anyone" is a pretty low standard.
     
  10. mchammer

    mchammer 5,000+ Posts

    @Seattle Husker

    You questioned whether this technology exists. Article is actually in Grist:

    The power plant of the future could run on nuclear waste

    Oklo is just one of several nuclear startupsworking on advanced reactors. There’s NuScale, building small, modular reactors, Terrestrial aims to have a liquid-salt reactor going before 2030, Bill Gates’ TerraPower is working on a traveling-wave reactor, and then there’s Kairos, X-Energy and many others each with investors betting millions that they’ll be able to find a way to make clean energy safely and cheaply.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  11. Monahorns

    Monahorns 2,500+ Posts

    There is no doubt that nuclear can be cost efficient. The problem is that no investment has been made until recently to continue to improve the process for efficiency and safety.

    There is also Thorium which is a type of nuclear fuel that is consumed in the liquid state. That means it is inherently safe. The problem with traditional nuclear is the high pressure tanks used for the cooling baths. That is the source of the explosions, not the radioactivity itself.
     
  12. mchammer

    mchammer 5,000+ Posts

    Huh??? The DOE has an entire program on this very thing. The new reactor types mentioned above are fail-safe technologies.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. Monahorns

    Monahorns 2,500+ Posts

    Really? Where are all the nuclear plants being built over the last 20 years? I said recently.
     
  14. Sangre Naranjada

    Sangre Naranjada Liquor Man

    In submarines, for one.
     
  15. Monahorns

    Monahorns 2,500+ Posts

    Those are not anything like a power generation reactor. Doesn't count.
     
  16. mchammer

    mchammer 5,000+ Posts

    There is investment in technology here in the US. Gen 3 plants are being built all over the world. They are much better than the older plants in the US and Japan.
     
  17. Monahorns

    Monahorns 2,500+ Posts

    Again. Really? I haven't heard of nuclear being built only decommissioned. Where are these new reactors being built?
     
  18. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez 10,000+ Posts

    Iran??
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  19. mchammer

    mchammer 5,000+ Posts

  20. mchammer

    mchammer 5,000+ Posts

    7DE5766E-D399-49EB-915A-C78298C5623E.png
     
  21. mchammer

    mchammer 5,000+ Posts

    US has 2 under construction: one in GA and the other in SC that is currently delayed due to cost overruns.
     
  22. mchammer

    mchammer 5,000+ Posts

    When I was in Lianyungang, PRC for a plant start-up, we met some good ole boys from Tennessee at the airport who were there starting up a nuclear reactor. I drove past it one time. You should get out more.
     
  23. mchammer

    mchammer 5,000+ Posts

  24. Monahorns

    Monahorns 2,500+ Posts

    Glad to see them being built. Again though my comment wasn't than investment isn't happening today, but that is wasn't being pursued much in the recent past.

    Good to see the trend is changing.
     
  25. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez 10,000+ Posts

    Where are the antinuke dumb-fucks? Why aren't they protesting China building so many of these? It's disturbing that so few of these plants are being built in the West.

    This is what pisses me off about the modern environmentalist. While we're falling all over ourselves to build these stupid wind turbines and banning plastic straws, China is building a mess of nuclear power plants and dumping assloads of plastic into the ocean. And the environmentalists don't give two squirts of piss about it.
     
  26. mchammer

    mchammer 5,000+ Posts

    You know the answer: it’s more about feeling good about themselves vs doing the right thing.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  27. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

     
    • WTF? WTF? x 1
  28. Sangre Naranjada

    Sangre Naranjada Liquor Man

    Another Bernie voter bites the dust.
     
  29. I35

    I35 5,000+ Posts

    “life is hard, but it’s even harder when you’re stupid”. John Wayne.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  30. Crockett

    Crockett 5,000+ Posts

    I have a non-smoking friend dying of lung cancer and my wife's best friend, also a nonsmoker died of the disease in 2010. Is Smoky Joe Barton to blame? I don't know and I'm not accusing, but I worry about the health impacts of air pollution.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1

Share This Page