Loss=Texas football is irrelevant.

Discussion in 'On The Field' started by caryhorn, Nov 16, 2019.

  1. caryhorn

    caryhorn 5,000+ Posts

    Not in the hunt for anything other than a winning record. 7-5 or 8-4. I'm worn out with this team beating itself with poor play calling, dumb coaching decisions, poor discipline, etc.

    Teams like isu have less talent than Texas, but are playing better football. Playing sound football. Doing more with less. Isu has not had a top 20 recruiting class in forever. But their coach is really good. That is the difference maker.

    This is such a disappointing situation.
     
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  2. I35

    I35 5,000+ Posts

    I’ve never been so frustrated in all my years. I guess because we were getting highly rated recruits and we were showing such improvement that we had high expectations. The lack of discipline by our team is astounding. Our coaches get paid too much money to put this product on the field. We are lacking in all aspects from top to bottom. Just some of the little things would make a difference.

    Then to pour salt on the wound we see Oklahoma down 31 to 10 at halftime show heart and come back to win over Baylor. It’s about attitude. We don’t have the right frame of mind. It seems like everyone is getting better as things are falling a part.
     
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  3. MajesticII

    MajesticII 500+ Posts

    Folks you have to get into volleyball and softball.. The only "sports" Texas is worth a damn in these days. ( I know we are good in swimming and golf .....but I consider those recreational activities. Nobody across the nation gives a flip about them at all...Do you see them on ESPN, FSN, etc. very often ? No...because nobody cares about them). We are #1 in volleyball right now and softball got close to the WCWS last year with most players coming back for this season.
     
  4. zuckercanyon

    zuckercanyon 1,000+ Posts

    Tough year, injuries didn’t help. Still think posters on this site are wrong when they say Texas has much better talent than these teams....
     
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  5. Walking Boss

    Walking Boss 1,000+ Posts

    Can’t tell if we have much better talent because the talent we do have is at a disadvantage against every opponent due to inferior game plan/schemes and in game decision making that defies explanation. The fact that we are in most games in spite of the coaching deficiencies suggests that our base talent is better than most.
     
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  6. zuckercanyon

    zuckercanyon 1,000+ Posts

    Calling bs on that. When they do poorly it’s coaching so when something goes right it’s coaching or it’s the players both ways.
     
  7. caryhorn

    caryhorn 5,000+ Posts

    There are a few positions where the talent difference is nil. But overall, we recruit better, by far, than TCU, ISU, KSU, TTU, BU, KU, OSU, and WVU.

    isu has a really good QB. Not much difference in the talent level there. Our receivers are much better. Our Defense is much faster, stronger, and athletic than isu.

    Sadly, Tom was out coached by a mile today. From the opening kick off to the last second.

    Tom and Beck did finally pulled there heads out of there asx in the last minute of the first half. And then put it back in their asx in the last 4 minutes of the game.

    And our D cannot get a stop in crunch time, when we absolutely must have one. Orlando fails in his defensive calls in the crunch repeatedly.

    BU next week will be a test. It shouldn't be. the only position where BU is comparable to Texas in talent is QB. Our O line, D line, receivers, DBs, are much more athletic; our depth is better.

    But we will be underdogs and rightly so. TH has the team under performing. One good thing is that Herman has them playing full out, with great heart, energy and toughness to the end of the game.

    But TH is making poor in game decisions, poor play selection, and seemingly choking in the clutch--like today when he went into a shell on our last drive, failing to make a first down, calling two ridiculous run plays straight up, no deception, nothing. ISU couldn't have asked for two easier plays to defense. ISU was stacked against the run there.

    ISU, if they had our talent and athleticism, would be undefeated.
     
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    Last edited: Nov 17, 2019
  8. MajesticII

    MajesticII 500+ Posts

    Our running game section of the play book is ONE FREAKING PAGE with two plays on it. PLAY ONE: Sam taking the snap..stammering around looking for a hole then SLOWLY running into the line.PLAY TWO: Sam handing off to a back who is standing still 5 yards deep, then said back runs slow to the hole ( which 95% of the time is the 2 or 3 hole...once in a while its the 4 or 5 hole....THAT IS IT !!!!!!!!!!!!! That is our run game...How many quick pitches, true sweeps, misdirection counters,jet sweeps, etc have you seen in the last 10 games, 20 games,30 games ? ...and our all knowing coach wonders why we can't run the ball against anyone with a pulse. Hell I'm shocked we were able to run for 100 yards against KSU !!!
    Our passing game....Bubble screens, hitches, sidline routes, and fades 95% of the time to one or two WR positions. Have you watched other teams utilize the entire field and their TEs ? Injuries ???? Hell OU was without the BEST WR in football yet they had no problem putting up 30+ points after their QB quit fumbling the ball. Other teams lose their starting QB and they keep putting up big numbers. Folks its a SCHEMATIC PROBLEM, that will not be fixed because Tom Herman is too darn stubborn or too stupid to try and fix it. He thinks the problem is all execution because it works against weak teams, so he thinks if the players play their "absolute best "it will work against quality opponents too.....Sadly for the players and fans it doesn't work that way unless your talent level is twice as good as the opponent or a good team brings their C game to the contest once in a blue moon.
     
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  9. nashhorn

    nashhorn 2,500+ Posts

    Uh, you watched Mims? They definitely have talent at receiver. Oh and at TE too.
     
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  10. caryhorn

    caryhorn 5,000+ Posts

    I mostly agree^^^. Especially at tight end, who is a stud. Our stable of receivers, top to bottom, is the best in the B12.
     
  11. BevoJoe

    BevoJoe 5,000+ Posts

    I agree, we have talent. But it is not being developed, and also we have coaching decisions which, early on in games, do not put them in a position to score. Lately, the O plays nearly flawless ball to catch up or take a lead. That is primarily built on the players themselves putting out the effort. We get 3 quarters of 3 & outs, stalled drives, etc.

    The issues start with the coaches, poor schemes and play calling decisions. They don’t put the team in positions to be successful. Then, we’re too vanilla on both sides of the ball as well. I hope I’m wrong, but at this point, this season’s ending is headed for a train wreck finish. I do not believe we will beat Baylor, Tech is a toss up at best, and who knows what might happen in a bowl game. 9-4 is the improbable ceiling while 6-7 is also a reality and would bring us full circle back to the Charlie Strong years. I have no idea what CDC might do about it. Anything is in the realm of probability.
     
  12. dukesteer

    dukesteer 2,500+ Posts

    Bingo. It’s not the players. Like someone else said, they’re playing their hearts out. Games like last night are even close because of their effort.

    They’re being let down by a coaching staff that may not possess the competence to compete at a higher level.
     
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  13. BevoJoe

    BevoJoe 5,000+ Posts

    And the screen pass that was snuffed at the LOS. Worst play calling when trying to kill the clock I’ve seen in a long time.
     
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  14. moondog_LFZ

    moondog_LFZ 1,000+ Posts

    Then I guess you can add poor recruiting to the list.
    Because we certainly should have better talent.
     
  15. BevoJoe

    BevoJoe 5,000+ Posts

    We have recruited well and have raw talent, but it isn’t being developed. Both the O and D are stagnant from lack of innovation and imagination on the coaches part. The way this season has played out, I suspect we may lose a few more recruits in the 2020 and 2021 classes, hopefully not, but recruits are not dumb. They see what’s happening on the field and lack of player development and the same plays and schemes being run over and over without change. Bad situation right now.
     
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  16. zuckercanyon

    zuckercanyon 1,000+ Posts

    You should change that to recruiting retention...
    Senior Class 2016: #11 class, 28 commits, 1 5-star, 13 4-Stars, 14 3-Stars
    Fowler the 5 star ended up at Sam Houston State
    Of the 13 4-Stars, that included Patrick Hudson, D Christmas Giles, Jean Delance, Demarco Boyd, Denzel Okafor, Chris Daniels, Kyle Porter, JD Urquidez which all transferred or didn't make much of a contribution
    Of the 14 3-stars, Lil Jordan and Malcolm Roach and Zach Shackelford and Chris Brown have made contributions.
    So that's 5 4-Stars and 4 3-Stars out of 28 players

    DuVernay, B Jones, C Johnson, S Buechele, J McCulloch are the 4 stars that did something

    Junior Class 2017: #31 class, 18 commits, 8 4-Star, 8 3-Star, 2 2-Star
    8 4 stars are:
    Gary Johnson/Sam Ehlinger/Damion Miller/Montrell Estell/Josh Thompson/Toneil Carter/Reese Leitao/Marquez Bimage

    8 3 stars are:
    Kobe Boyce/Taquon Graham/Derek Kerstetter/Cade Brewer/Daniel Young/Sam Cosmi/Josh Rowland/Jourdan Pouncey

    2 2 stars are:
    Max Cummins/Jamari Chisholm

    I'd say Gary Johnson/Sam Ehlinger are the best out of that bunch. We could argue about the contributions of the rest.

    But these are your Seniors and Juniors that are supposed to win the conference? They don't stack up against the deep recruiting the better teams have. MO
     
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  17. dukesteer

    dukesteer 2,500+ Posts

    Zuck, even if I concede your premise for the sake of discussion, our talent is still superior to everyone on our schedule except, arguably, LSU and perhaps OU.
     
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  18. AC

    AC 1,000+ Posts

    This illustrates my points as well. Plus all the dismissed players from the Strong era which affected years of OLine recruiting. Texas was really in a pile of hurt when TH got here. We had 3 or more years of huge attrition in each class before TH. If we end up 9-4 or 8-5 this year it’s disappointing but appreciate where we came FROM. I think we will be improved next year.

    Yesterday compared to this time last year SE was without LJH, Beck, CJ, Cade Brewer. 4 major, experienced targets who bailed us out of countless third downs the last 2 seasons.
     
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  19. nashhorn

    nashhorn 2,500+ Posts

    I have to ask, considering those 4/3 stars where do you say missed initial evaluation vs development? I really like those named and think so many of those 3’s have done well but could be even better.
     
  20. nashhorn

    nashhorn 2,500+ Posts

    It also, IMO makes more of my contention PLAY them!!!
     
  21. zuckercanyon

    zuckercanyon 1,000+ Posts

    My theory is that most of the teams we play would love having 4s n 5s but rarely get them, so it’s a stable full of 3s. And they get to play n get reps and there’s no super stars. They play Ohio state Alabama LSU Other Top 10 schools the lose by 3 tds because those schools are two maybe three deep at many positions with 4s n 5s. Take a team like Texas with several Juniors jumping ship for the draft over these first three seasons and you don’t have equal talent replacing them, Texas will have struggles at times especially when your underclassmen who are the foundation of “we’re back” start getting injured about the same time. Of course I’m discussing the defense. Now, Texas’ three stars are riding the bench where they might be playing at SMU etc. Baylor comes to mind. They’re not necessarily better if even as good as their counterparts at Baylor. But now they’re starting and showing why they’re on the bench. Baylor n tcu n Iowa state meanwhile are running their three star machines to the best of their abilities and scratch out wins when they shouldn’t against Texas and OU and that’s admirable and more power to them. But then they play each other and it’s 3 star football and there’s no big brother envy/drive and oops TCU loses a few. Believe DKR referred to that as flies in the soup or ointment or something to that effect. OUs defense had a good game against us but everyone else has been scaring the crap out of them . We’re closer than many here think to becoming even with the big guns in recruiting. Let’s see what December’s signed class looks like. Examine what’s coming back next year. You may be surprised at what’s evolving at the 40.....
     
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  22. AC

    AC 1,000+ Posts

    :arrow-up:
    And to dovetail off of this post. I think TH's tenure so far should be compared to 98-00, MB first three years. Or compare it to CS only three years. TH is lightyears better than CS and just a hair behind MB. I think CS was THE worst coach Texas ever hired. By comparison Mackovic may not have been well liked, but he was a good X and O coach especially on offense. He was a good recruiter too. Therefore, MB had better talent than TH in the beginning. That is our best comparison for TH. Then after that look at most good or now great coaches like Dabo Sweeney and they took a while to get going. TH has some talent to work with but no way is Texas 3 deep with 4s and 5s which Zucker mentioned above. THat is the difference. Talent took a hit this year with all the departures and graduations last year, and this year it was a double whammy with massive injury losses. If the recruiting class is good this year and in the Spring, Texas will be much better next year. I think we end up 9-4 or 8-5 worst case this year. Not that great but nowhere near CS levels and its a platform to grow from. The attitude from some posters is all negative no positive and I simply cant look at it that way. TH is a good coach, run him off and we'll all be sorry later. The play calls that worked last year don't work as much this year because we are not as talented and twice as banged up. If J Whitt had been able to play all year, we may have a couple more wins than we do now. :idk:
     
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  23. Crockett

    Crockett 5,000+ Posts

    Not sorry to be absent from the football board lately. I watched the ISU game again. Hell, we weren't that bad. ISU is good. Absent a Homer call on in Norman, they would probably beaten OU on their second opportunity for a two point conversion after refs let an obvious pass interference call go. Our coaching is good, our talent is good, but overrated by the services who know they make more money pumping up Longhorn recruits than they would making them sound the approximate equal of the kids going to Baylor and TCU.

    I know many of you see me as a Pollyanna and sunshine pumper. Hey I watch this game for fun and entertainment, not self validation. If you want to whine, moan, and call for firings after every loss... just know to me it looks arrogant, juvenile and most importantly, no fun.

    If you think your complaining and calling for firing coaches makes the program better … I think your wrong, but have at it cause nobody can stop you. It's been that way around here forever. It's a wonder Darrell Royal lasted as long as he did.
     
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  24. dukesteer

    dukesteer 2,500+ Posts

    Crockett, I can name one prominent individual who doesn’t agree with you...

    Tom Herman
     
  25. nashhorn

    nashhorn 2,500+ Posts

    Crockett liked your post but after my rewatching the ISU game I though that our first half was worse than I’d thought after watching it live the first time. But I will say I gave a lot more credit to the ugliness to coaches and calls the second time.
    Otherwise you and I are dead on.
     
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  26. Crockett

    Crockett 5,000+ Posts

    Yeah, obviously his feelings are more intense than mine. I used to be miserable after every loss and were I in charge I probably couldn't help it. But I've had enough real bad stuff in my life that I'm not going to spend much time being miserable over the loss of a football game, especially one that was interesting and exciting to watch.
     
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