LINK Though not likely to pass, North Dakota residents will vote this week on eliminating property taxes all together. It certainly raises all sorts of questions most importantly how to recapture all the lost tax revenue should it pass, but this is a very interesting story and potentially motivating for several other states. Curiously the chamber of commerce and public worker's union are strongly opposed to this move and working together to lobby against the movement. On a personal note I support reducing if not eliminating property taxes in Texas in lieu of sales taxes. As the article states, no tax should have the power to leave someone homeless.
Does ND have a State Income Tax? ND also has a major influx of out of state folks that are having to buy everying and are basically squatting. They are trying to get the out of state workers to pay a bigger share of the pie. In Texas you want to eliminate Property Tax for an increase in Sales Tax, to what 30%? You would kill business in this state and drive them to relocate. I don't think that is a good idea. Property Taxes are a little high in Texas but you don't have a State Income Tax and the cost of living is pretty low. I'll keep what we have.
Granny needs to move before Capital Gains taxes increase. Sounds to me like she can make out like a bandit and mover further out again. I have not problem with my Property Taxes and the school district that I live in. You can compare it to others, leave my Sales Tax, property tax and state income tax alone and we have no problems. We don't have a revenue problem or a bad spending problem in this state, why would anyone want to change it? Whenever someone says it can be done better there is an agenda, what is it? Increasing the Sales Tax makes the poor poorer, the same pair of shoes that a guy making $100,000.00/year is taxed the same as a guy making $25,000/year, increasing the Sales Tax on a poor person's consumes more of their income. Even Mr. Conservative myself would be against raising the Sales Tax, 8+% is high enough. I feel that I get get value out of my Sales tax and property tax, I have or see no need to change them. If Granny does not like where she is living or how much it is costing her then move. The Haggards in Plano made out like bandits in the 1970's and 1980's.
Mr. Deez, your guy was awesome! I would kill for no property tax and hiking the sales tax to 11%. But that 11% figure was before today's various DART extra 1% here, local's extra 1% there stuff. Even then, if you go to 13% sales tax total, dang, that's a lot lower than paying between $2000 and $4000 a year in property taxes.
How is that possible unless your mortgage is <$1k per month? My property taxes her in the Seattle area are ~$5k/year. I thought that was high.
I pay a multiple of any amount posted yet here in Dallas. Not bragging, not complaining. Just stating in a resigned fashion.
Hate to say it but majorwhite said it very well- see moderates and Conservatives can agree! Property vs. sales tax- which one do you want to "discourage"? Neither, you want both, so putting an undue burden on one of the two makes it completely unfair for certain groups of citizens. A balanced approach like what Texas already has is not worth messing with. In the NorthEast many states forgo sales taxes on back to school weeks or similar etc but of course the property taxes are through the arse! Anything above 8% on sales unfairly punishes poor people, and too much property taxes raises the cost of both ownership and rent for everybody. So, keep it the way it is! By the way, ND is stupid for considering this. And their "blessing" is a short term blip that in no way is worth destroying a fair system over for something that will last a decade or two max.
Winner of the Internet Malapropism of the Day award goes to: "viscous cycle" (viscous: of a glutinous nature or consistency; sticky; thick; adhesive) Viscous cycle
Let me add that while I disagree with mcbrett on the long-term economics of the Bakken I agree, somewhat, that their ought not be elimination of property taxes. They could be lowered substantially and raised appropriately when necessary. Eliminating them altogether is begging for a clusterfuck when they are needed. However I understand why this in on the ballot. North Dakota apparently has property taxes that fall in the middle of all states, yet, the state still has an income tax. I'd like to know what that is, but the drilling boom over the last 5 years there suggests a sharp reduction in property taxes is merited. I don't buy the article's assertion that oil revenue cannot be diverted. That's bull ****. It may not be "simply" diverted, but it can be. Still, eliminating property taxes altogether seems drastic. More information is needed to determine proper mix of property tax / income tax revenue relative to funding needs.
Come to think of it, "viscous cycle" might actually be a more appropriate term for the situation, if one considers the potentially sticky or unforeseen consequences -
Rex, you may have a little too much time on your hands to analyze posts- I can assure you I don't write anything intending to "draw you off sides" or anything with you really. But, for once, you responded in a civil manner so how can I pass that up. Let's agree to not debate how long the Bakken play lasts, because neither of us really knows and speculating is a waste of time. My decade or two comment is very clearly meant to say, "it ain't lasting forever" or aka long enough to change a fundamental process to fund your budget. And that is where we disagree- I don't think a temporary source of revenue, whether it's 5 years or 50, should justify changing an already and fundamentally fair system of taxation. A government, unlike many of it's people, should plan decades ahead, not years ahead.
According to this interview with Tom Pauken and Harvey Hildebran, comparing Texas with N. Dakota is an apple/oranges situation. For one, ND doesn't use property taxes to fund its public education system. the link
According to the one article I read this morning, the elimination of the Property Taxes in ND was defeated by a big margin. The article did not give numbers.
There is a group here in Texas that is working on trying to eliminate property taxes in Texas (with a revenue neutral tax alternative). If this issue interests you, you might contact them for details, or to offer comments / (constructive) criticism: http://wetexans.com/ They had a booth at the Texas GOP state convention this past weekend and from what I hear, had some pretty positive conversations with lawmakers. FWIW, after the last thread where we discussed this issue (The Link ), I contacted We Texans and suggested that they publish a FAQ page addressing the questions and concerns raised by folks like majorapplewhites et. al.. They haven't done so yet, but it's on their to do list.
