Post-Trump GOP

Discussion in 'West Mall' started by BrntOrngStmpeDe, Jan 25, 2021.

  1. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez Beer Prophet

    If they're failures, then why should they be defended? Seems like a losing proposition to me.
     
  2. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    Exactly. If there is silence on a topic you can be assured there isn't support.

    For me personally, I haven't visited the Biden accountability thread for months recognizing it was simply a place for Trump supporters to whine. I'll let them have their place to vent, absent reality. ;)
     
  3. Horn2RunAgain

    Horn2RunAgain 2,500+ Posts

    fify
     
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  4. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    Nah, please don't try to put words in my mouth, an all too common occurrence with some here. Too many strawman arguments due to an inability to debate the poster in front of them.
     
  5. OUBubba

    OUBubba 5,000+ Posts

    I play the role of pivot man in the circle all too often. I figure a thread picking apart Biden would be like a Sooner posting...never mind.
     
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  6. Monahorns

    Monahorns 5,000+ Posts

    True. But if they would have stood their ground, if FDR would have packed the courts, we would remember FDR much more honestly as the tyrant he was.
     
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  7. Horn2RunAgain

    Horn2RunAgain 2,500+ Posts

    Inability to debate.. that's why you haven't been to the Biden accountability thread. Prove me wrong. Certainly there's SOMETHING he's fked up that you could provide some defense. Bring blueanon with you, if he isn't too busy inventing new friends that died of covid..
     
  8. Garmel

    Garmel 5,000+ Posts

    :popcorn:
     
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  9. mchammer

    mchammer 10,000+ Posts

    You know why? Because Biden and Harris are making Trump’s election a ******* cake walk.
     
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  10. Horn2RunAgain

    Horn2RunAgain 2,500+ Posts

    Does anyone right now really believe Biden could beat anyone? Even Trump

    The buyers remorse on the shitshow is so bad right now, Trump would carry NLT 35 states. DeSantis, my current choice, would do the same
     
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  11. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez Beer Prophet

    You and I might, but I'm not sure the public would. The media and academic world would defend the move. They'd say, "well he had to do it. They were striking down his agenda." It's a little like when they defend DACA. It's an abuse of power, but they justify it by saying "Congress wouldn't act," as if that's a reason to knowingly break the law.

    By the way, though I defend the Four Horsemen on New Deal cases, I'm not a huge fan of those guys, because they were believers in the Lochner doctrine, which was as legally tyrannical as Roe or Dred Scott.
     
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  12. theiioftx

    theiioftx Sponsor Deputy

    Feel free to enlighten us with any positives for Biden or Harris. You won’t because you can’t. He has been a total disaster with Covid, Foreign Policy, Economic Policy, American Unity, and Immigration.
     
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  13. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez Beer Prophet

    Barring unemployment being at about 25 percent, Trump will never get elected in a cakewalk. It'll be a nail biter again, and he'd likely lose the popular vote again.
     
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  14. Monahorns

    Monahorns 5,000+ Posts

    Could you explain? Sounds interesting.
     
  15. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    I have no desire to jump into another pissing match where the argument strategy of choice is strawman arguments. It's as if y'all think Bubba and I are card carrying members of "The Crew".

    Now, back to the regularly scheduled topic of this thread: Post-Trump GOP. It's clear there is not "Post-Trump" GOP. Maybe the thread title should more appropriately be titled Post-GOP Trump? The Republican party is no more. It's being purged of the value system it's espoused for decades in favor of whatever Trump wants.
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2021
  16. Horn2RunAgain

    Horn2RunAgain 2,500+ Posts

    So, no positives in regards to the policies and results of Biden and Harris?

    Interesting. After seeing Gaetz just now castrate Milley and Austin I can understand why
     
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  17. BrntOrngStmpeDe

    BrntOrngStmpeDe 1,000+ Posts

    I disagree. There is still a substantial number of typical GOP supporters out there but the fight or flight response has made many of them glom onto Trump for the time being. Trump has been really effective at making other GOP pay a big price for anything less than full throated support, so many of them are waiting it out in relative silence, but that is not the same as saying they have all changed to Trump. Trump is strong at motivating his base and they are of course fearful of that possibility. I think some GOP Senators that were recently re-elected (hence 6 yrs to bide their time) should come out and declare their opposition to a Trump re-run for the good of the party.

    But i do think Trump has changed the type of candidate that will succeed in the GOP for the near future. The go-along candidate will not be tolerated any more. If you are not capable or willing to push back strong against MSM, you won't be the GOP nominee in the next 2-3 cycles. Trump's policies are not that different than other GOP. His willingness to go no-holds-barred(with anyone and everyone, friend or foe) in the political ring is largely what is different.
     
  18. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts


    Thank you for the thought provoking insight. It could be there are many traditional GOP conservatives in hiding. They disguise themselves at Trump supporters because anything less that than in the GOP is committing party seppuku.

    The question is that when Trump finally releases his chokehold on the party, will there be any room for more traditional GOP'ers to regain prominence. What happens if Trump has already purged those people from party leadership and installed his own people? We are already seeing that occur at the local and state party level. The more traditional GOP are literally being sidelined with less deep, more extreme Trump sycophants replacing them. Examples of these types of people are Karen Fann/Wendy Rogers in AZ but they are there in LA, GA, PA, WI and others. They identify themselves by admonishing/censoring any politician that doesn't support Trump in full-throated fashion.

    I'm clearly not a GOP'er but I think's it's a massive miscalculation if the traditional GOP thinks they can simply wait out Trump. He has fundamentally changed the GOP both in membership and party platform. It used to be that the GOP had reliable principles that even if you didn't agree were typically more the "adult" in the room focused on more reality issues.

    I have the same fear about the Democtratic Party but Biden's nomination is at least 1 clue the moderates of the party still hold the keys to power for now. Unfortunately, the same can't be said about the Republican Party. There, the moderates or truly principled conservatives (as opposed to anti-Progressive) have been marginalized or excised (see Liz Cheney) from the party.

    We'll have to agree to disagree that Trump's policies are "not that different from other GOP". I get the perspective that compromise is not acceptable, the left has that wing of their party too. Trump's policies on immigration, debt, education and several others were very different, even radical compared to the GOP. The fact that the extreme positions have become normalize don't mean they weren't radically different than previous GOP stances.
     
  19. OUBubba

    OUBubba 5,000+ Posts

    Pre-trump the Madison cawthorns, MTG, Lauren Boberts of the world didn’t get elected. Now they’re all in a contest to see who can hug the trump flag the best.
     
  20. Horn2RunAgain

    Horn2RunAgain 2,500+ Posts

    I thought TDS would have subsided a bit by now. I stand corrected
     
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  21. theiioftx

    theiioftx Sponsor Deputy

    You won’t because you can’t. Deflecting about red herrings and the good old days is an excuse. And excuses are like ********. Just give us something to say Joe is good for the country.
     
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    Last edited: Sep 29, 2021
  22. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez Beer Prophet

    Madison Cawthorn is really tragic, because there is potential. He's a young, good-looking guy who's well-spoken for his age and has obviously overcome something really terrible to accomplish something big. (He also has a hot wife.) There could be cause for optimism. However, he then opens his mouth and is clearly a massive wingnut. (He's also rumored to be a pig in his personal life.)

    Sad.
     
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  23. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez Beer Prophet

    I respect both of you guys a lot, so I hesitate to be critical. However, I think you're going about this the wrong way. Belligerently telling Husker and Switzer to come defend the Biden Administration isn't going to be productive, because though I don't think it's coming from a place of contempt, it is clearly coming from a place of bad faith. You're not going to have any kind of meaningful dialogue.

    If you really want their comments, why not simply bring up the things you think Biden is screwing up (spending too much money, inflation, poor border enforcement, sloppy withdrawal from Afghanistan, etc.), and ask what they think of them? Don't tell them to defend them. That presumes they agree with them. Probably, it's a more nuanced and mixed bag. You could even ask if they regret their votes. (My guess is that they don't because of what the alternative was, but you can ask.) You could ask what kind of Right-leaning alternative, if any, they might have chosen if given the chance.

    The point is that there's a way to open people up and get them to explain what they think of something, but belligerence isn't going to foster that.
     
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    Last edited: Sep 30, 2021
  24. theiioftx

    theiioftx Sponsor Deputy

    I respect you because you will call out the good and bad of what you see and have an honest debate. They didn’t hesitate to call out Trump during the last four years and continue even after he is no longer in office. Liberals and even moderates who ignore what is happening have blood on their hands.
     
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  25. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    @Mr. Deez is wise beyond his years. There are posters on the West Mall capable of having insightful discussions, sharing competing ideas, offering new perspectives that inform world views. Then there are posters who have some preconceived view of a "progressive" and apply that lens to the other side. The latter group isn't interested in learning, being exposed to perspectives that might influence their view. Rather, they simply want a platform for telling their opponent why they are wrong and inevitably fall back to insults when their arguments aren't convincing.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2021
  26. mchammer

    mchammer 10,000+ Posts

    Or, there are posters who provide links showing evidence of the idiocy of the left and leave it at that.
     
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  27. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 10,000+ Posts

    Was your intention to declare yourself to be in the latter bucket by jumping to the insult so quickly? If so, the transparency is appreciated even if the sentiment isn't.
     
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  28. Mr. Deez

    Mr. Deez Beer Prophet

    I'm not suggesting that you not call out Biden. Feel free to criticize him as you see fit, as they called out and criticized Trump. He has certainly earned plenty of criticism, and it's only fair to call him out. What I'm suggesting is that if you want others who supported Biden to engage those criticisms, I think you'd get a more meaningful discussion if you asked differently.

    Just my opinion, and yes, defending Switzer feels like chewing on sand.
     
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  29. mchammer

    mchammer 10,000+ Posts

    The comparison is fairly simple:

    leftists: mean tweets, jade helm, and Russia collusion !!!

    normal folks: Biden shît show!!!!!
     
  30. mchammer

    mchammer 10,000+ Posts

    Jade Helm!!!!!!!!!


     

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