Ranger recap, re: Hamilton and pitching staff

Discussion in 'Baseball' started by orangecat1, Oct 6, 2012.

  1. orangecat1

    orangecat1 500+ Posts

    It should have never come to this. But, it did. The reality for me is that Hamilton hit what should have been the World Series winning homerun last year. If that had happened, he would have gotten a career contract after that winning series and would have earned every penny.

    That's what makes this seem like an unreal proposition, that Hamilton is gone.

    Shoving that aside, this year Hamilton had the 2nd most ineffective "great" season in Ranger history, only behind ARod's MVP year for a last place Rangers team.

    I believe Arod's year will be the last MVP ever to play for a last place team.

    The funny thing is that after Hamilton's hot start this year, supposedly there were a few contract negotiations happening, but then somebody got smart and set let's just wait and see how the entire year turns out.

    How much $$ has Hamilton cost himself with his contacs, caffeiene, tobacco drama queen act? Impossible to tell I guess, but here are two really interesting things.

    1. The Rangers actually got a great return on their Josh investment, look at the attendance, 3.5 milllion fans. The team had never broken 3 million before, even last year didn't break 3 million.

    2. The Rangers front office has a layup for a decision. If I'm Jon Daniels, I think twice about even making an offer, but for PR purposes, I go ahead and make a very small offer, maybe a 3 year deal for far less than Michael Young makes per year.

    Iow, the Rangers will move on, find some other free agent with no drama queen stuff, and figure out the pitching.


    The pitching staff, this is where the front office will make their tougher decisions.

    1. Feliz, is he a starter or reliever?
    2. Colby, do you count him as part of the 5 man rotation, or do you make sure you have 5 other starters ready?
    3. Nathan- does he come back?
    4. Dempster- bring him back, I hope so?


    And the elephant in the room, Washington's problems handling the bullpen. Is this all on Ron, or do we assign some blame to Maddux? Is there a way for Daniels to get Wash some tutoring over the offseason to better prepare him for next year?
     
  2. HornHuskerDad

    HornHuskerDad 5,000+ Posts

    It was a very promising season to end with such a thud. But it's over, and it's time to look ahead to next season. There are plenty of reasons to be optimistic, but also some very serious concerns to be addressed.

    I agree with the OP on Josh. Jon Daniels has to make an offer, but he should make an offer Josh has to refuse - three years at $16/year, maybe. Some team will go crazy and offer him big bucks and a long contract - so be it. Take the two draft picks and go on.

    Profar is ready to play. I'm very disappointed with Kinsler - too many errors at 2B and he's not a prototypical leadoff man. Let Andrus lead off. Put Profar at 2B and the infield and lineup are already improved.

    The Rangers have some free agents of their own to address. Mike Napoli and Mike Adams should be signed - no-brainer decisions. What about Scott Feldman? He has a $9.25M option for next year, with a $600K buyout. I don't envy JD the decision on this one. Scott has some value, but not $9.25M. Roy Oswalt is done. There is an intriguing free agent out there to be had - James Shields of Tampa. He's 31 years old and an established performer - and Tampa can't afford the big bucks he'll command. He would be a nice addition at the top of the rotation. The Rangers should try to sign Ryan Dempster for two or three years - his veteran presence would help stabilize a young staff. Zach Greinke is a free agent, but after the Angels traded their top prospects to get him, you can bet they'll break the bank to sign him long-term.

    Sooner or later Michael Young will be done. Yeh, I know - he's the face of the franchise, a great clubhouse presence, and he's done everything the Rangers have ever asked him to do. But his production dropped significantly this season. He's a nice utility infielder, but the defense lessens every time he's on the field, regardless of position.

    Now look at 1B. The Rangers didn't get a lot of production from Mitch Moreland. Mike Olt looks like he's ready for the big league, and he has worked some at 1B.

    Replacing Josh in the outfield will be a challenge. Nick Swisher is a free agent. He's in his prime, he's got some pop with the bat, and he's a very good defensive player. The Yankees have other targets to sign - like Russell Martin and Robby Cano - and they might not have enough payroll flexibility to keep Swisher. Justin Upton might be available from the Diamondbacks via trade, but I don't know which prospects the Rangers would be willing to trade.

    Uehara has performed well. I know he's getting old (38?), but for the limited role he performs, he's probably good for another year. We certainly have no reason to gripe about Adrian Beltre, so we're set at 3B. Murph showed that he is capable of being an everyday player. Gentry is a keeper. Nellie Cruz is signed for next year, but he needs to improve his batting average to justify a new contract after 2013.

    The Rangers have to improve. Everyone in the AL West will be better (except, of course, the Astros). We should see some action at the Winter meetings.

    I'm disappointed, but I'm still a Ranger zealot - and I want to see a better result next season!

    HHD [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  3. ViperHorn

    ViperHorn 10,000+ Posts

    The season started going downhill around the All Star break and then cratered in September.

    My thoughts going forward:

    * Josh is gone. I am not sure the fans would hold it against the R's if they did not make an offer.
    * Yu, Lewis and Harrison are the only starters who are safe. Holland and the remainder of the starters should only be kept if nothing younger can be found. Yu will be the unquestioned #1 until he gets old or hurt.
    * I want to talk to the doctor before saying sign Adams.
    * Felitz is a reliever; Ogando is useless; Ross is a keeper.
    * Beltre, Andrus and Murphy are the only fielders who are safe
    * Washington is safe but none of the other staff are. However, Nolan will have a heart-to-heart with Wash about fielding and base running. If Nolan does not get the response he wants, Wash might start next season but be on a very short rope.
    * Ryan also need a heart-to-heart with MY. We need you, but if the bat goes silent for an extended amount of time we have to make a change.
    * Ryan is going to have to assert himself so Daniels might find a new home.

    At least 4 months until pitchers and catcher report.
     
  4. petscii

    petscii 250+ Posts

    I'm willing to wager that the Astros don't finish last in the AL West next year.

    Francona to Texas and see if he wants to keep Hamilton?
     
  5. Crockett

    Crockett 5,000+ Posts

    The Rangers bashed their way to a lot of wins early in the season and nobody bashed more than Hamilton. There's nobody on the horizon to replace that kind of homer, RBI and total bases.
     
  6. Rex Kramer

    Rex Kramer 1,000+ Posts

    Just like TO leaving left a huge statistics hole with the cowboys. Any talk of retaining Josh is crazy. I think it'd be borderline retarded to even make him an offer. He isn't owed that courtesy and we could end up stuck with him which would be terrible. This guy personifies locker room cancer. It's the ultimate addition by subtraction.

    I think viper got it mostly correct. Murph, andrus, profar, Beltre, and Cruz should be considered day 1 regulars. Hamilton is gone and I don't think we need to play any games there - it's a no brainer and should have no fanfare. Dealing with Face and Kins will be much tougher, but gladly, I expect neither on the roster next year.

    I disagree that Nap should be resigned unless he can be had for very, very cheap. We were all witness to his career year in '11. That was the anomaly.
     
  7. HornHuskerDad

    HornHuskerDad 5,000+ Posts


     
  8. Crockett

    Crockett 5,000+ Posts

    I read in the Morning News that teammates patience with Hamilton was wearing thin. Let him make $20 million a year for the next 7 tears somwhere else. I think we should keep Napoli, and it doesn't have to be on the cheap. He's a decent catcher and a solid homer and RBI man. Is Profar ready to take over for Kinsler at second base? Andrus to leadoff? The Rangers need a big bat from somehwere. The Martin/Gentry platoon in center would be fine defensively and hell on the basepaths, but where are you going to make up the RBI and homer totals. Torri Hunter would be a good fill in with great outfielder with power and experience, thought he's not up to covering center field anymore. The News says B.J. Upton is the next best outfielder hitting free agency.
     
  9. busterbrown16

    busterbrown16 1,000+ Posts

    A couple of rumors and then my personal thoughts:

    1. Fort Worth Star Telegram reported that a top Ranger front office person said that the Rangers would not re-sign Josh "even if he was willing to play for free." Josh's schtick wore off in the clubhouse and they are ready to move on. It will be tough for the fans, but how can you blame the Rangers for not wanting to sign a 33 year old former drug addict with a history of injuries and a lot of drama? Not to mention he completely gave up on this team.
    2. Profar to likely start at 2B next year and Kinsler will be moved to LF.

    My opinions:
    1. See what the market will bear for Cruz. He still has some value and he was too cold at times this year. Move Murphy to right field, play Gentry in center, and Kins in left and bring in a 4th outfielder.
    2. Young will likely be gone. He still has some trade value and a team might be willing to trade an OK bullpen guy for him and the Rangers pick up some of his salary.
    3. The staff is a mess. Holland was overused during the World Series run and this year showed it. I am glad he got paid to reward him for his stellar work in the playoffs last year. Maybe he will come back stronger next year, but I would handle him carefully so perhaps he can re-find his makeup.
    4. Feliz will never be in the bullpen again. He was ruined in Game 6 of the Series last year.
    5. Not sure what happened to Ogando. He got hurt in SF and then was never the same. He is critical to the bullpen success.
    6. I agree we should wait to hear from the doctors on Adams. He became ineffective near the end of the year. And, unfortunately, if the Rangers want to sign him, he will probably require a premium because he was such a critical piece of the World Series team last year and he will likely want to get paid for that.
    7. Why would we bring Dempster back? We would need to overpay and he was not that great for us, especially in the final game at Oakland. Word is that he was always headed back to Chicago anyway.

    These last items are speculation on my part. I watched the collapse in Oakland live and I have never seen a team so obviously ready for a season to be over. They gave up on the year and I think a lot of that had to do with their leader and superstar (Josh) giving up on them. They knew that without him they could not make an extended run in the playoffs, so it was not shocking the reaction.

    Daniels and Ryan have a lot of work to do. Hopefully they have a plan to get this team back to where they were.
     
  10. FWHORN

    FWHORN 10,000+ Posts

    I am resigned to Hamilton leaving not because I want him to but because I don't want the Rangers to break the bank to bring him back and that means he is gone. He just isn't worth what the yankees, angels, dodgers etc are willing to pay. I would re-sign Napoli if the price is right and yes Kinsler to LF and Profar into the lineup seems like a no brainer.

    Big issue is how healthy will Lewis be next year. Yu is definitely the number one starter and Harrison, Lewis make a good 2-3. i would like to see Holland back and Dempster as our 4-5's with Feliz back to the pen when he gets healthy.

    It is hard to see the rangers winning the west next year as i think the Angels put it together and spend their way to a title but you never know with baseball, no one would have predicted the a's winning the west this year.
     
  11. ViperHorn

    ViperHorn 10,000+ Posts


     
  12. HornHuskerDad

    HornHuskerDad 5,000+ Posts

    I listened to the Rangers press conference today on 103.3. It was mainly the usual platitudes, but one piece of substance did arise. JD said that the Rangers will not make an initial offer to Josh - they will let him test the market and look at his offers from other teams before deciding what to do.

    I'm assuming that some team will make a bank-breaking offer to Josh, and if so, the Rangers should thank Josh for his contributions to the team and wish him well.

    HHD [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  13. ViperHorn

    ViperHorn 10,000+ Posts

    Exactly HHD. Some owner is going to bid against himself and give JH crazy money. The issue is the over/under on how long it takes JH to implode and leave his new team in a financial crunch. I will throw out out August of the first season.
     
  14. TheNewGuy

    TheNewGuy 100+ Posts


     
  15. ViperHorn

    ViperHorn 10,000+ Posts


     

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