S&C Stuff

Discussion in 'On The Field' started by Chop, Dec 13, 2019.

  1. Chop

    Chop 2,500+ Posts

    Yancy McKnight was hailed, upon his arrival, as a fantastic addition to the staff. Now, plenty of people are sniping at him. So, what do you think? Is he good? Who's better? What are we doing right? What are we doing wrong?

    My personal amateur take and two Pesos (worth about that much, depending on the exchange rate): I think Yancy excels at making players stronger, putting on the muscle mass, and (to a lesser degree) losing the fat mass. I think the conditioning/endurance aspect of our program is average, maybe a bit better than average. I'd say there should be a greater focus on flexibility. Also, some positions (WR, CB, RB) have athletes that may not perform better if they're bigger--even if the greater size comes entirely from more muscle. We may be packing on too much muscle weight on some athletes that rely on quickness and speed for their effectiveness. Perhaps if the linemen, TEs, and MLBs had one program, focusing mostly on getting stronger (while not neglecting conditioning and flexibility), and the skill positions had another program, focusing mostly on track/speed/quickness (while not neglecting strength), we might be better off.

    After all, we're training for football, not power-lifting meets.
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2019
  2. BevoJoe

    BevoJoe 5,000+ Posts

    This pretty well sums it up.
  3. BurntOrangeLH

    BurntOrangeLH 2,500+ Posts

    Yeah, I mean just look at that Ingram kid. Increased muscle mass by 10% and quicker also. Just way overrated. Moro Ojomo? A bust! Ta'Quan Graham? YOu kidding me? That Sweat kid? Only 320 from 280? And he played as a freshman?

    Something is reaaaalllly wrong here.
  4. Chop

    Chop 2,500+ Posts

    Some, including me, would say that 320 lbs was not the ideal playing weight for Sweat.
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    Last edited: Dec 13, 2019
  5. SabreHorn

    SabreHorn 5,000+ Posts

    The problem with EVERY S&C coach is it has to be "his way". Every one of them has an idea of what the "ideal" football player should be, whether it is what the program or the individual kid needs or not.

    Lots of people didn't like Dana LaDuc, but we had more OL benching 500+, drafted by the NFL, and hanging on in the NFL than at any time in our school's history. Hell, Brian Mallard wasn't a starter, but was better than any OL we've had in a decade and maybe multiple decades.

    Talk to me about McKnight when we are well conditioned, own every fourth quarter, and have OL & DL with serious upper body strength.

  6. BurntOrangeLH

    BurntOrangeLH 2,500+ Posts

    Like 2018? I will be sure to get back to you on that after you watch some game video.

    Texas was good this year before our secondary was wiped out three deep, Whittington and Collin were injured, and Roach and McCullough had to miss a few games.

    the good thing for next year is a lot of guys who should not have been on the field did get game time experience which will help them next year.
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  7. SabreHorn

    SabreHorn 5,000+ Posts

    Sorry, I have seen every game Texas has played. Almost all live, but a couple on TV following surgery (scheduled around certain games). I have not seen a "well conditioned" Texas team since Dana left Austin. Sure as hell not under Mack Brown and that waste of space Puppy Dog Madden.

    Yes, I was in NOLA, and a little disturbed that defensive starters were in Harrah's after midnight on NYE. That game worked out wonderfully well, but it's the first time a Texas team showed up hungry other than OU.

    I was all in on Herman and his hiring. His insecurity masked as arrogance is wearing thin.
  8. dukesteer

    dukesteer 2,500+ Posts

    Burnt, we had plenty of 4th quarter collapses in 2018, including OU, OSU and WVA.
  9. zuckercanyon

    zuckercanyon 1,000+ Posts

    Out after midnight?! Bobby Layne probably never went to bed!!!!! Hook em, Sabre!!!!
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  10. Chop

    Chop 2,500+ Posts

    Some good links on LeDuc are posted below:

    Longhorn Nation

    "I cannot tell you how valuable Dana LeDuc was because of his strength training. I played with some very good offensive linemen who played not only at Texas but went on to have extended careers in the NFL, and a lot of it had to do with Dana." Bryan Millard in the above link.

    Dana LeDuc: Bio · Longhorn Power · Stark Center : Omeka Exhibits

    Strength , Conditioning, and Rehab

    "LeDuc states, "I really believe there is no type of athlete that weight training and strength work can't help." LeDuc believes in utilizing strength and flexibility exercises to combat joint injuries."

    "LeDuc's coaching philosophy is based around strength development as a means to increase on-field performance for football players. He allows athletes to transition into more power and sport specific movements once a standard level of strength is attained."

    "LeDuc also believes that athletes conditioning will improve by use of "quick bursts of speed over shorter distances" compared to the "lap after lap" of long-distance runs. He also adds Olympic weight lifting techniques to mirror the physiological demands of football."

    • Like Like x 3
  11. SabreHorn

    SabreHorn 5,000+ Posts

    Thank you, Chop
  12. Chop

    Chop 2,500+ Posts

    You're very welcome. The amount of praised heaped on LeDuc, from many different people, is so immense, it makes you wonder how we ever let him get away.

    LeDuc was the gold standard of S&C training. (at least back then)

    I couldn't find the link for it, but I seem to recall it was Steve McMichael that said his success and longevity in the NFL can (at least partially) be attributed to LeDuc. I guess LeDuc's workouts have some applicability to pro wrestling as well. :yes:



    Below: Steve "Mongo" McMichael in the pro wrestling ring against another former NFL DL, Reggie White.

    I could see this guy still bringing the intimidation factor to the conference table at a negotiation. LeDuc's weight training for the business world...
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    Last edited: Dec 17, 2019
  13. SabreHorn

    SabreHorn 5,000+ Posts

    I took some HS kids to Austin to meet Dana one year. They were all good students who were undersized from families that couldn't afford to pay for college. Dana gave them a tour of Moncreif and took them in the weight room, where he proceeded to give each a suggestion to improve speed and strength.

    While there, McMichael walked in and proceeded to start his workout including benching 500+ for the kids. He then pointed to Dana and told the kids, "I am too short, but this guy here is the reason I'm starting my thirteenth year in the NFL.

    Some of the people that didn't like Fred got on a campaign to fire Dana because his lineman weren't weight trained properly and because he would go out and drink beer with them.

    FWIW, three of those kids got "academic" scholarships to play football and graduated good small colleges. One Austin College, One Trinity, One Hampden Sydney, the latter starting and being all conference three years.
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  14. Chop

    Chop 2,500+ Posts

    It is evident that both LeDuc and McMichael are quality individuals that The University should be proud to be associated with.

    WTF was with the anti-Fred folks griping that LeDuc wasn't properly weight training linemen (and campaigning to get him fired). Like they really knew better than LeDuc (who ended up an NFL S&C coach for many years: Seahawks 1995-1998; Rams 1999-2008). I bet Joe the independent oilman, Jack the real estate developer, Will the banker, and Stan the inherited wealth playboy could really school LeDuc on how to properly weight train linemen. :rolleyes1:
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    Last edited: Dec 17, 2019
  15. SabreHorn

    SabreHorn 5,000+ Posts

    I wrote Mack Brown and Puppy Dog Madden a letter, saying that I was greatly disturbed that Dana was not brought back to Austin. I was concerned about his financial well being, BUT

    Dana told me not to worry, that he had gotten a job with a small private school about 6% the size of Texas. I asked about his salary and benefits to which he replied that the school had given him a nice ring that said "National Champions".

    Dana then took a job with a private football club. Again I was worried about my friend's well being, but he said it was ok, that they gave him a ring that said "Super Bowl Champions'.

    Hence, my ears for my friend could be set aside and my fears turned to the lardass Mr T wannabe turning my favorite team unto marshmellows.

    I then encouraged Brown to get rid of the waste of space and bring back Dana or Dana's recommendation if indeed Dana was too busy polishing his jewelry to coach.
  16. Chop

    Chop 2,500+ Posts

    Maybe, just maybe, the current staff could set aside their egos for a moment and bring him in for a one-off consult. Give us some tips. What are we doing right, what are we doing wrong, what to do that we're not doing, etc. For crying out loud, if we can bring in Greg Davis to "consult", surely we can bring in LeDuc for a little consultation.

    I, for one, don't things are broken in our S&C program. Rather, I think we need to go from a B average to an A or A+ My amateur philosophy is also that some of our big dudes may have actually gotten a bit too big (including some of the wrong kind of weight)--to the detriment of quickness and speed.
  17. SabreHorn

    SabreHorn 5,000+ Posts

    Bringing Greg in is a cannon shot screaming "we are clueless". Greg is a good guy, but he has been a horrible coach since Doug Etheridge left PNG.

    If you are a much sought after offensive mind or his agent, would you want Greg Davis looking over your shoulder?

    I defer to Rick Lantz and his thoughts & actions where Greg is concerned
  18. BurntOrangeLH

    BurntOrangeLH 2,500+ Posts

    Based on conditioning? I do not think so. Blown assignments or announcing suspension penalties days ahead of game times.

    OU RRR? Really? Texas really "failed" on the game winning drive. I will take more of that, please.
  19. BurntOrangeLH

    BurntOrangeLH 2,500+ Posts

    You really believe "Pro wrestling" is a competitive sport and not an exhibition?
  20. Chop

    Chop 2,500+ Posts

    Usually, when one sees this little emoji :yes: by something that is obviously tongue-in-cheek (based on the context), that's a clue that the sentence in front of the emoji isn't meant to be taken too seriously.

    Although, that being said, there is certainly a level of athleticism and strength required in the kabuki theatre of pro wrestling. While it's a staged performance, you still have to be strong to lift up a 300 lb man and body slam him.

    LHABSOB 250+ Posts

    Whoa Whoa Whoa. What is this ‘exhibition’ talk? There has never been anything more real than the Von Erichs!!! :smile1:
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  22. SabreHorn

    SabreHorn 5,000+ Posts

    Did you know that when Dave Campbell did HIS Half Century Team, the guards were Gene Maye and Jack Adkisson, aka Fritz Von Erich. He was apparently one helluva OL in HS and at SMU.

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    Last edited: Dec 17, 2019
  23. zuckercanyon

    zuckercanyon 1,000+ Posts

    Every crime in the world happens behind a wrestling referees back...
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  24. Chop

    Chop 2,500+ Posts

    Speaking of pro wrestlers, somebody told me that Kamala just made a run for President of the USA! And I thought you had to be born in the USA to be President. :yes:

    I heard somewhere that “Kamala” was actually a truck driver from Mississippi.
  25. Chop

    Chop 2,500+ Posts

    Yep. The retirement track for Big 12 refs is to get a job as a pro wrestling ref. Or maybe I got that backwards...
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  26. SabreHorn

    SabreHorn 5,000+ Posts

    Rasslin is too honorable for Anderson, Walleye, and their clowns
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  27. dukesteer

    dukesteer 2,500+ Posts

    Are you disputing the fact that we had a 4th quarter collapse in the 2018 RRR? If so, I’m not sure what game you watched. The final score doesn’t change the validity of my observation.

    Conditioning? I really don’t know. But what I do know is that we haven’t fared particularly well late in many games on the defensive side of the ball. Hopefully Ash can change that.
  28. Sangre Naranjada

    Sangre Naranjada Winebibber

    They probably all post here, majestically. Just ask them and they'll give you more than an earful about how they would do it better.
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  29. Chop

    Chop 2,500+ Posts

    As John Cleese (Monty Python) would say: And now for something completely different.

    (Note: I'm not advocating that we hire this guy, so don't everybody have a cow. :cow:)

    Marv Marinovich

    Marv Marinovich's fanatical, strictly enforced, family healthy living regime (no sodas, no candy, no birthday cake, no nothing) probably took a heavy psychological toll on his son Todd Marinovich growing up. Todd M. went wild when he got out on his own at USC and with the Raiders. Todd M. got into some rough drug habits, and ended up on the street.

    Still, Marv Marinovich knew training, and his ideas about football training radically changed over the years. To boil it down (heavily simplified and paraphrased), Marv apparently started out with the following initial philosophy for training football linemen: get bigger, get stronger, get even bigger, get even stronger, get even bigger still, get even stronger still. Quickness, flexibility, balance, speed, joint health--who cares, that sissy stuff is for ballerinas, pole vaulters, and gymnasts... This is how Marv trained himself. He was a two-way starter at lineman and captain of the USC Trojans, winning a national championship in 1962. He was ejected for fighting in the 1963 Rose Bowl. His family background was tough, to say the least--his grandfather was in the Russian Army and oversaw the amputation of his own arm.

    Then, while playing for the Raiders, "he over-trained himself based on weight and bulk with little time for recovery." Marv had his Eureka moment and radically changed his training philosophy, becoming one of the NFL's first ever S&C coaches (Raiders). Marv studied Eastern Bloc training methods. Marv's approach evolved into a focus on training for speed and flexibility, including core and swimming pool-based conditioning, flexibility, and balance, in addition to weight and strength training. He has trained football players (including Troy Polamalu-Steelers), as well as pro MMA fighters (including BJ Penn). One source calls Marv Marinovich the "godfather of the NFL combine format".


    Marinovich Training Systems | IMS Acadmey

    ProBodX by Marv Marinovich

    Gravity + Systems Train in HyperGravity with the Gravity Plus Suit - Why training your nervous system is so important
  30. Austin_Bill

    Austin_Bill 2,500+ Posts

    Don't base anything on Todd Marinovich. The ESPN article calling him Robo Quarterback was 100% BS. Todd was doing Coke in high school and eating whatever he wanted. That whole story was made up. I actually met Todd the year he was drafted, I was living in Utah when he came to party with a few of his friends that played for BYU. He was like Vince Neil from Motley Crue, snorting coke off the back of prostitutes.

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