Do we want to go there? I almost hope, since I don't care for him, that Obama pardons Hillary. Pros to Pardon 1) We avoid another polarizing moment in the epilogue of this election. 2) Obama cements his legacy as a corrupt Chicago politician (at least that's a pro in my book). 3) Free of this issue, Trump can start on the right foot. Cons to Pardon The Law is a joke.
I agree with points 1 and 3. If Obama doesn't pardon Clinton, Trump will be under enormous pressure to prosecute her aggressively. That would be awesome if it could be done quietly, behind the scenes. But that wouldn't happen. The prosecution will be a circus, and it will paralyze all effort to implement change. Obama could do Trump a huge favor by freeing the next year up for actual governance.
I say drop it. That is a huge step for me since I would have been prosecuted to the fullest if I had done that while I was in the military. Let's move on as a nation and work together to solve our greatest challenges that this new mandate the American voters have given the Republicans.
No, the voters have given their judgement. To heal the country, this issue needs to die. Can Obama pardon HRC when no formal charges have been brought?
I was wondering how Obama's pardon would work since Clinton has not been charged of any crime, and Obama cannot effectively pardon after he leaves office(?) Can he legally pardon some un-named crime? Odds are high that the email scandal will not cause an indictment against her personally. A special prosecutor would focus more on the Clinton Foundation and the favors extended from that - particularly with what happened in regards with the approval of the sale of 50% of this country's uranium to Russia. I think many of the people who voted for Trump would be angered by not appointing a special prosecutor, which he was clearly proclaiming that would happen if he would be elected. Trump's credibility is at stake. I think that Trump could make that appointment and sit back while he says, "Let justice take it course." He could do it without stirring up the revenge emotion.
That's why I hope Obama pardons Hillary. Trump comes out it without compromising his word and Hillary, while not in jail, is completely disgraced and Obama's legacy also takes a big hit. From Slate - The President can pardon once the act was committed.
Two worthwhile benefits to starting a new investigation and prosecuting all those who broke the law... 1) Expose the corruption inside the original investigation and purge DOJ and FBI of rotten elements 2) The Obamas will try to hugely influence future politics If Obama was really part of a cover-up and it seems he apparently knew of her use of the private server, he needs to be held accountable too. Whether people want to accept it, being careless with classified info can get people killed. It's not trivial to break these laws or protect those doing it. Either Michelle will run for office in the future and/or they will pound the trail for the next challenger. If BO is guilty of crimes while in office (which it's pretty clear he is), these need to be exposed and prosecuted. Not to mention a lot of Americans died while he refused to enforce our immigration laws and protected sanctuary cities. That alone is enough to want to punish him if he's guilty of breaking other laws. Punishment is meant to be preventative. Future presidents need to understand they will be held accountable for purposeful illegal actions screwing over the people.
But can Obama pardon everybody who commits a named crime? Would he pardon Bill in addition to HRC -- particularly in regards to the foundation? Would not Obama have to be very explicit in the naming of the crime itself? Could he say " I pardon everybody who was involved in a coverup to hinder an FBI investigation?"
Hillary was just supremely humiliated. Throw out the bums at the DOJ and FBI and move on. However, Hillary and Bill get a warning about CGI, but I'm guessing new donations to the foundation will dry up at this point.
Gowdy as AG would work, IMO But I dont know what BHO will do It appears its legal for him to preemptively pardon her if he wants He already began making strings of pardons months ago I expect more of this into the end
As painful as it may be, he should probably appoint a special prosecutor. He was elected as a repudiation to business as usual politicans. Politicans over promise and under deliver. He needs to be a President that when he says he'll do something, he follows through - a President who's word the American People can trust. In Life, you can never go wrong with keeping your word. Regular hard-working people know this, and that's in part what those people who voted Trump expect him to do. See sig.
If he appoints a special prosecutor, there is no hope of healing or uniting the country, especially when so far the Director of FBI has recommended no charges. So, by all appearances, the optics of this would be very poor to those HRC supporters (not all her voters but a large portion). If more information emerged around the Clinton Foundation that prompted a charge then that may change. Absent that a "special prosecutor" would be perceived as an attempt at political retaliation. texex2000- We agree that the mere presence of a handful confidential assets on the private server would be enough to charge her but what's the value at this point? Clearly Director Comey didn't think intent could be established.
The Clinton Foundation is under investigation and most likely will have ties with the DNC and multiple political operatives. If the goal is genuinely to "drain the swamp" and root out corruption, granting immunity and giving pardons won't accomplish that. Banks are continually found guilty of fraud and manipulating markets. No one ever is charged with a crime. The banks pay their fines and continue with their corrupt business models. This is no different. There is no "healing" when crime goes unpunished. It just encourages more and will allow the parasites to keep stealing from and controlling the system of government.
The value? The value is the integrity of our laws. Integrity to itself and nothing more, is the only value when considering the execution and enforcement of the Law. The virtue and effectivness of laws are up to a democratically elected Congress. To your point about Comey not recommending charges - everyone and their uncle knows that was a politically influenced move to avoid an even potentially bigger cluster in the final months of The Election of all elections. "No intent?" Give me a break. It was politically influenced - not legally guided.
This times two. I would let the investigation play out though. No sense in appointing a SP until more info comes out. I expect Comey to step down anyway.
My argument is that the greater good of "healing" outweighs the process of a special prosecutor to determine if a crime has been committed. Keep in mind that special prosecutors recently have also been very political and it's my belief that more hyper-political drama is not beneficial to bridging the clear electorate divide. Politically influenced? Comey doesn't seem to be the type to bow to political pressure as evidence by his letter to congress 11 days before election day.
Well Husker, that's what's great about the Law. She doesn't have an opinion about such things. Well that's definitely an interesting circuitous excuse. How about we go with the best evidence rule. She had classified material on an unauthorized/uncertified private home server, lied about handing over evidence, lied about ever receiving a OPSEC briefing, and destroyed emails after being subpoenaed, but didn't get charged. Oh, that whole she's the Democratic nominee for President with 3 months to go before the election...I'm sure that didn't have anything to do with it. Come on Seattle, I'm not going to insult your intelligence by suggesting you actually believed what you typed.
Complicated question. I think she deserves to be charged, and I think he has an electoral mandate to go after her. After all, he promised to appoint a special prosecutor. However, I agree with SH and NJ that this would be bad for national reconciliation. Furthermore, it would dominate the agenda and shift the focus away from policy, where it should be. It could ruin Trump's first term. However, Trump can't avoid charging her and save face. As awful as this sounds, the best thing that could happen would be for Obama to pardon her.
I hope this is what happens and the issue is forced out of Trump's hand. This is the prisoner's dilemma. An Obama pardon is the best thing for Clinton, Trump, and Obama.
Even if Comey was wrong to recommend against prosecuting, he isn't a Democratic hack. He's a life-long Republican, originally appointed to a senior FBI position by George W. Going against his recommendation, which was at least ostensibly based on the law, and prosecuting him now would come across as pure politics. That's the last thing the country needs right now.
This. Plus, it could give us a Democratic Senate in 2018 and a boomerang Dem in the White House in 2020. I'd rather the party consolidate gains and govern, letting posterity (and the almighty, if you believe) take care of revenge.
I'm not saying he's a Dem hack. Honestly, I completely empathized with his no-win situation not at all of his doing and don't blame him at all. He's human and he made a completely defensible choice given the unique situation. I would not have made the same choice, but I'm not stoning him for it. I'm just calling it as it is and I still have respect for him. Now, he's free of this pressure of the election. If Obama doesn't pardon, it would be up to Trump and the Special Prosecutor.
If he does, there is nothing we can do about it. Just move on. We have plenty of more positive items to focus on now. It will stain her and taint her legacy for the rest of history.
It appears they opened the door to it today This douche actually framed enforcing federal criminal law as "political revenge"
The email thing is bad, but if it goes away for the sake of healing I get it. However the CF pay for play scam was no excusable crime. It's actually got treasonous components. Any logical person willing to judge the evidence fairly would conclude that MANY millions were accepted in exchange for gov favors and awards. Geez, just look at all the ambassadors that donated to the CF before she gave them their post. Wikileaks basically proved it just by the "friends of Bill" emails. You don't just say "water under the bridge" to the worst (and multiple) white collar crimes ever committed by a cabinet member. This criminal didn't decide on gov jobs and contracts by qualifications or if it would best serve the people, she handed it out to whoever ponied up the cash regardless of effect. Chelsea is a young woman and heavily involved in the leadership of the CF. If it's a corrupt scam like a mountain of evidence suggests, it needs to be destroyed and reparations made so Chelsea has no ability to use it for future crimes.
The lies from HRC were to cover up multiple fronts. The email scandal has taken up so much oxygen in the air that the pay-for-play investigations have seemed to be in the background. However, there are 4-5 different FBI investigative offices with work happening just to focus on the CF activites. There is a so much smoke surrounding those investigations that there has to be a real fire not visible to the public. It will not be possible for BHO to craft a pardon to include the corruption on both the email (classified state department docs) and the huge amount of monies in multiple occurrences that were transferred through the CF. Based on the reports, my hunch is that Comey did what he did to control the civil war between the DOJ political appointees of BHO and the FBI rank and file. His compromise was to let the email prosecution slip in order to later concentrate on all the "money trails" in all the pay-for-play activities in the CF where both Bill and HRC were involved together. Comey has laid the foundation publicly for a special prosecutor to handle the Clinton Foundation past activites. BHO can do his pardon to help out with the healing in the Dems, but there has to be charges brought to air out the stink from the CF activites. Now that the threat from another Clinton administration is gone, HRC will have no control over the fury in the CF investigations that will now come to light next year after Trump's inauguration.