2018 Roster

Discussion in 'On The Field' started by Joe Fan, Nov 28, 2017.

  1. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    Decided this has become a hot topic, and deserves its own thread

    Will start with the departures. This time last year, I was thinking the recruit class for 2018 would be small because we would have so few seniors. This has changed quickly. We are now looking at a very large turnover of the current roster.

    Antwuan Davis
    Armanti Foreman
    Jason Hall
    Poona Ford
    Garrett Graf
    Naashon Hughes
    Lorenzo Joe
    Dorian Leonard
    Kendall Moore
    (one senior may come back via medical - Beck)

    Early departures
    Alex Anderson RS JR
    T Cuney RS JR
    Deshon Elliott JR (confirmed)
    Garrett Gray RS JR
    Holton Hill JR
    Malik Jefferson JR
    Jake McMillon RS JR (finished degree but might come back)
    Charles Omenihu JR (seemed to say 'bye' on his twitter)
    Garrett Thomas RS SO
    Connor Williams JR
    Chris Warren JR

    Kris Boyd JR (NFL)
    Shane Buechele SO (chatter on this goes back to Spring)
    Toneil Carter FR (poss transfer for increased PT)
    D'Andre Christmas SO (almost left in Sept)
    Eric Cuffee FR (a name coming up)
    Michael Dickson JR (NFL)
    Devin Duvernay SO (the brothers might transfer out together)
    Donovan Duvernay RS FR
    Tristian Houston SO (hardly ever suits up for game day)
    Cameron Townsend SO (another that does not suit up often)

    Possible medical
    Kirk Johnson

    Unfortunately, the rules have changed and we can no longer oversign at will and apply the EEs to last years class. It's trickier now. Bad timing for this change because we could probably sign 30-40
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2017

    KBBAKER 250+ Posts

    I wish all NFL prospects, malcontents, early departures, etc. would leave ASAP. Let's see what we have left. If a player isn't buying into the current system (justified or unjustified), it is time to kill the cancer. Herman needs to sign "his" own players to make this thing work. If 40+ players leave next week, that's fine with me. Hopefully, they can be replaced with equal or better talent.
    • Like Like x 1
  3. Galvestonhorn

    Galvestonhorn 100+ Posts

    The sooner the roster is 100% of TH recruits (2018 and beyond), the better off Texas will be.
    • Like Like x 1
  4. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    The exits do seem to be happening. But the 25 man limit in recruiting is hard now, when it used to be soft. The new rules are still somewhat confusing but if there is a loophole, I didnt see it. In short, we will not be able to sign 30 or 35 players, which is probably what we are going to need.

    Put it all together and we are going to have a very young team again in 2018. Throw in issues with some of the assistants, and it is beginning to smell like Strong's Year 2.
    • Like Like x 1
  5. nashhorn

    nashhorn 1,000+ Posts

    Smells stinky to me and unlike above posters it disturbs me. I don't remember this kind of voluntary exit numbers in Strongs 2nd year. Puts a huge ? mark in my mind on TH and his player relationship building and yes, I do think that is critical to success.
    • Like Like x 2
  6. ViperHorn

    ViperHorn 5,000+ Posts

    I am not sure we have enough fact to back this statement up as he has had only one "second year". If one looks at his third year (the current Cougar High squad) the fall-off is noticeable (and Applewhite is equal to or better than what Herman showed this season at Texas).
    • Like Like x 1
  7. IvanDiabloHorn

    IvanDiabloHorn 1,000+ Posts

    Some of this stems from the Hill suspension. I saw a difference in this team after the suspension. Would be interesting to know how many departures, especially Jrs, have two positive tests. A few don't want to gamble a six game suspension in their senior year. Those that are leaving because they don't buy into the system...well bye bye, don't let the door hit you in the rear.
    TH is going to build his team the way he wants to and if he fails , he fails. If he succeeds, he succeeds. He is throwing his dice. If he wins the bowl game , he has done better than the first year of the last coach.
    My money is on TH.
  8. X Misn Tx

    X Misn Tx 1,000+ Posts

    However many early departures make NFL teams would be points in favor of Charlie's recruiting. Connor, Elliott, Hill, Jefferson...great recruiting with top notch performance. We'll see about the rest.
  9. ViperHorn

    ViperHorn 5,000+ Posts

    Just remember that the NFL and the agents want as many people in the draft as possible so they are telling the eligible players to come on down.; the players hear what they want to hear; declare and then wonder what happened to that first or second round selection that they were assured.
  10. Chinstrap

    Chinstrap 250+ Posts

    Good analysis of a worst case scenario, and hopefully nowhere close to what will really happen. Today's athlete has pretty lofty opinions of their worth and many get upset at their role and the immediate reaction is to get mad over playing time and move on. Unfortunately many are just not as good as they think they are and it does not work out for them. Quitting seldom is the best answer.

    Those not going to the NFL can have a lifetime experience on a team and on a campus with everlasting memories and a great education. And what is wrong with working harder to move up? I once sat on the bench in a game, on fourth string. Did not like it. The next week in practice I moved to a starting position and that was a life lesson I will never forget. Moving from second team to first team can happen and should be the goal of all players. David McWilliams once said that on the 1963 National Championship team the players looked at the the roster each Monday when they came to practice to see if they still had their starting position. How they had played in the game was a deciding factor on whether they were still on first team.

    Perhaps Tom is looking only for kids with that attitude. His job and that of the other coaches is to rid the team of bad attitudes and motivate those left. I don't know how many disenchanted players he has but I heard that Poona said that his biggest regret is not having another year to play with his teammates because they are going to be really good. Accept that as true and you have to believe that the team has more positive attitudes.

    I agree that this team can be really good. It always starts with a great defense and these kids are well on their way. The offense is a problem and if Tom does not understand this and is not willing to fix it, Texas football is in trouble. I cannot believe that he is not aware and so the only question is what is he going to do about it. As frustrated as I am, I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt until he proves me wrong.
    • Like Like x 1
  11. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    It means we will be young all over the field next season, again
    Which probably means a sub .500 season, again
    It will be great to carry forward a young group on the same team into the future. But one really bad season might also mean we get passed up by some other teams in recruiting.
    For now, the two things I am waiting to see are --
    (a) What is Coach going to do about his assistants, if anything? and
    (b) On recruiting, can we reel in the JUCO OT talent we are after? I think and hope landing who we want at OT will go a long way towards stabilizing the 2018 offense. Failing looks like trouble
  12. easy

    easy 2,500+ Posts

    Holy hell this is worse than imagined when you look at it on paper.
  13. nashhorn

    nashhorn 1,000+ Posts

    Never thought I'd feel this way but I'm hoping for a big JUCO haul - I'm sooooo tired of losing.
  14. Horns11

    Horns11 5,000+ Posts

    I think the OP is definitely worst-case scenario. I don't see some of those "maybes" leaving, but definitely 3-5 of them. The silver lining is that we have had so few upperclassmen competing for meaningful playing time the last few years, that it'll be kind of like losing a "big" group of upperclassmen rather than what it looks like on paper.

    Herman needs his guys. And we need to give him the same benefit of the doubt that Strong got. Orange-tinted glasses show me the following:

    1. We're bringing in arguably the best DB class in years, and probably the best in the nation. Losing Elliott/Hill hurts, but I think if other leaders will step up and help this new group, it'll eventually be like the group that anchored our backfield from 2004-06.

    2. We have depth at WR, just need a QB who can get the ball to them and an OL that is pass-first oriented. I think Rising will eventually be that guy if the coaches convince Ehlinger to play Belldozer.

    3. I think the staff saw this year as a trial-by-fire rather than "let's try to win the conference," which sucks for fans, but probably will reap some benefits for attrition and knowing their roles for next year. If guys don't buy in, including coaches, Herman can exercise more ability to move people around and find younger guys who can do the job.
    • Like Like x 1
  15. mchammer

    mchammer 2,500+ Posts

    What do we have coming back - worst case?
    QB - Ehlinger (hopefully improved in 2nd yr)
    RB - D Young and hopefully Carter
    TE - Brewer and Reese
    WR - Mapps, CJ, Lil J, Burt, Heard
    OL - Vahe, Kerkstetter, Shack, Mcmillon (hope), Hudson, Okafor, Rodriquez

    DL - Nelson, Roach, Hager, Graham, Wilbon
    LB - McCollough, GJ, Wheeler
    DB - Boyd, Locke, bonney, Davis, Jones

    Kicker - Dicker and Rowland

    Plus the youngsters in the bench and the 25 great recruits coming in. I think we will be just fine outside of OL.
  16. LonghornCatholic

    LonghornCatholic Romantic Catholic

    I don't think we can be fine without a good O-Line.
    Hope I'm wrong.
    • Like Like x 1
  17. mchammer

    mchammer 2,500+ Posts

    Doubt it would be worse than this year.
  18. Horns11

    Horns11 5,000+ Posts

    Yeah I have full confidence we'll use fewer than 10 starting lineups for the OL next year. Maybe 6-8.

    We need Hudson and Urquidez to be healthy. We also need Ghirmai and Moore to push for playing time so that we can move around guys to OG. I'm less enthusiastic about our interior OL than replacing Williams at LT. There's a chance the OL might be as bad as 2017, but probably not worse.

    People need to start getting pumped about Coburn and Ingram. We have someone better than Poona Ford or Chris Nelson enrolling to play DT for the next couple years. Ingram can replace whatever RB we may or may not lose to attrition.
    • Like Like x 1
  19. Galvestonhorn

    Galvestonhorn 100+ Posts

    I don't see why anyone is shocked and worried about losing a bunch of upper class men that are (giggle) declaring for the NFL draft or transferring that contributed to the worst 4 years in modern Texas football history.

    This teams talent is worse than their record. It is on par with Tech, Kstate, Iowa St type talent. There is a REASON bookmakers odds at a win total were 7.5 and that was inflated considering they know Texas people are going to bet it (like me). I knew it was a bad bet and I said Texas was in a tough spot this year.

    Who gives a **** if these guys leave. This should've happened 4 years ago with the right hire. Actually about 6-7 years ago.
  20. Badass

    Badass 1,000+ Posts

    I am more in line with your thinking but not all the way, not as harsh.
    My thoughts ...
    Who of the players we are losing ever played on a winning team? That was rhetorical, I think I know the answer.

    We want players that want to be here. Let the others go, imo, we will be better off. This is a re build. I will wait for the payoff. I hope you will too.
    • Like Like x 1
  21. dukesteer

    dukesteer 2,500+ Posts

    I'm guessing that the NFL draft will show otherwise in April with perhaps with as many a seven players being drafted, and perhaps four in the first two rounds.
    • Like Like x 1
  22. X Misn Tx

    X Misn Tx 1,000+ Posts

    i'm uneasy about both lines. It's not that we don't have great talent, it's that we are so thin in specific spots.
    • Like Like x 1
  23. Htown77

    Htown77 5,000+ Posts

    We had no draft picks in the 2014 NFL draft. The previous 3 years we won 8-9 games and ultimately finished 7-2 in Big 12 play in 2013.

    We could allegedly have 7 draft picks this year from teams that have have lost 6-7 games a year 4 years in a row and finished no better than 5-4 in Big 12 play.

    What is our goal? Winning football games or producing hyped up draft picks?

    Malik has to be the most overhyped player in Texas history. He has forced 0 turnovers this year. 0. He forced 0 fumbles. He made 0 interceptions. He recovered 0 fumbles. What a playmaker... NOT. Most of his “tackles” he gets run over and gives up extra yards. He might have a turnover if he did not miss the QB half the time he has a wide open sack. Im ready for overrated Malik to move on. His biggest accomplishment was being rated 5 stars and no one ever looking past that initial rating.

    Now losing Elliot would hurt just like losing Hill did. Those guys actually are pretty good.

    I am not sure what Connor Williams ever did. I have heard how great he is for years, but our offensive line has sucked the entire time and he is often injured.

    Like I said, the only big losses I see are in the secondary and potentially our punter. Otherwise, we are losing players who do not win anything.

    Truthfully, I think the last two years have been a mixture of bad coaching and overrated talent resulting in 6 or more losses a year.
    • Like Like x 2
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2017
  24. rick mueller

    rick mueller 1,000+ Posts

    Question. Does Kerstetter move to Left Tackle?
    Also at TE, we will also have Andrew Beck.
  25. ViperHorn

    ViperHorn 5,000+ Posts

    but we know what happens to TE's. :puke:
    • Like Like x 1
  26. Htown77

    Htown77 5,000+ Posts

    I will also add that Malik has the same number of sacks and only 2 more tackles for loss this year than Hager, who played significantly less.
  27. caryhorn

    caryhorn 5,000+ Posts

    i think losing Poona Ford is significant. I think losing Williams hurts. I think losing Malik hurts.

    I think the O coaches mismanaged Foreman and the QB situation. That whole mess comes back, only more blurry because we are gonna have a stud QB on Campus that might be a better passer than either of our returning guys. That will be interesting to see if Coaches know what to do with a truly gifted passer.

    Also will Coaches know how to settle on the best WR and give them enough starts and plays to develop a rhythm and learn how to run routes and make plays. So many changes in starters that no rhythm/timing/trust between receivers and QB's ever developed this year.

    Good point. Will Hager be allowed to play in all the games? Never did understand why he was held out for 4 or 5 games. He was our best pass rusher. Also was great at busting up sweeps, etc due to his quick penetration creating chaos.
    • Like Like x 2
  28. Htown77

    Htown77 5,000+ Posts

    It all depends on who is behind them. I said it earlier in the year, is Malik’s backup really that bad that he cannot beat Malik out?
  29. Horngal12

    Horngal12 100+ Posts

    Why are we assuming so many leave (transfer, etc). I remember rumors Chance Mock would transfer. He stayed and helped team as a capable back up and worked behind the scenes to help VY get better. I remember rumors that Case McCoy would transfer. He stayed and stepped up and had a great year when Ash got injured. Bueschele and company might not transfer though I wouldn't blame him if he did.
  30. X Misn Tx

    X Misn Tx 1,000+ Posts

    We had a running back run for 2028 yards last year. I feel like we're just angry because we suck.
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