2018 Transfer Season

Interesting comments about why the increase in transfers. Its a long read but hits on some some important points.

 

Great article.

 

There are some great nuggets in that article. It is a lengthy but it's a good read. Thanks for posting.

 

An example of a very in-voluntary transfer. I think I read some blurb that the university later came out (as the result of the bad press) and said they would full fund the scholarships (but not play) of the players "fired" from the team.

 

1. There you go again missing the point, as my statement said they were NOT given the playing time they should've been given. In other words, there were plenty of games where the victory was already secured WAY before mop-up duty.
2. My using Notre Dame as an example was to point out what a degree of flexibility and innovation to adjust and overcome (not to mention ACHIEVE) can do. Make all the excuses you will about how good Notre Dame's players were because that's the product of PLAYER DEVELOPMENT. At the end of the day, the fact remains we had more HS All-Americans on our roster than either Notre Dame or Baylor had available scholarship players. One got a NC and the other kicked our butts (count them) three times. Let THAT sink in. Aston gets no more excuses from me. The inept coaching has only been magnified. Sorry...
3) Are you SERIOUSLY referring to Arike Ogunbowale as "The young Nigerian kid?" Wow... with Google at your fingertips. SMH

 

Maybe if your point was valid it wouldn’t be so easy to miss. And the fact remains, even if they were given minuets way before mop-up duty it still wouldn’t have been very much playing time. And I’m pretty sure if Coach Aston did play them before mop-up duty and the opposing team came back you’d be crying about that.

And if you want to say that having talented players and playing a zone is great Innovation then be my guest. McGraw did a great job but let’s stop acting as if she was playing with a bunch of walk-ons and reinvented the wheel.


If you wiped the tears from your eyes you would be able to read because nowhere on here did I make or give any excuse. And I’m also sure Arike being proud of her Nigerian heritage like most Nigerians are would be fine with what another fellow African said. But I’ll let you get back to crying and whining.

 

If truth-telling is whining and crying, then a crybaby I will gladly be. You are, on your BEST day, delusional.

 

It’s good to see that you stopped crying long enough to actually type on the computer. You just couldn’t take the L quietly. But this thread is about transfers so if you want to cry and whine about how mediocre Coach Aston is as a coach for the 100th time you’re free to make a thread about.

 

Some of these comments are just silly. Comparing one situation (or program, or player for that matter) to another is an exercise in futility. It's fine to discuss transfers (in particular, when they actually happen), and their ensuing impact on the team. But tossing around terms like "player development', or discussing playing time and other potential reasons for departures that haven't happened yet, or throwing shade at a coaching staff that has easily been among the best in the country, just doesn't fly. A few things to consider....

The Horns have actually been incredibly lucky with respect to transfers in recent years, though luck probably had little to do with how things turned out. I am referring specifically to our top recruits (top 30, or McD AA's). Going back as far as 6 classes, and Imani, we've yet to lose a single one of our most highly touted incoming players. To the contrary, we've benefited from one such departure from another program. Yet I would never say SC wasn't giving Jatarie enough playing time, or 'developing' her properly, or even that she might not have done well had she stayed with the Gamecocks. All anyone can say is it didn't work out, or wasn't a good fit. Just how successful we've been at holding on to top talent is in evidence when I see the list posted above reflecting half of the HG top 25 from 2016 alone have already moved on; I'd hate to see what a full list of all top 25 transfers from 2012-2016 looked like. Yet, Imani, Ariel, Brooke, Lashann, Jordan, Joyner, Sug - and now joined by Jatarie - are all still Horns. There's a reason for that, which might be something for our 2017 class to consider when looking at their respective futures.

There are 350 Div I women's basketball programs. Just 6 have managed to make the last four Sweet 16's. UCONN, ND, SC, Texas, Baylor and Stanford. That says all you need to know about how far this program has come in an unbelievably short period of time. Look at the top programs that haven't managed to keep pace....Tennessee, Duke and Maryland have two final 16 appearances each during that stretch, and the Ags - just seven years removed from a NC - have made it just once. Another conference foe, OU hasn't made the Sweet 16 for five consecutive seasons (after eight appearances from 2000-2011). Maintaining that level of success for that length of time is a difficult thing to accomplish, as evidenced by the short list of teams who've managed to do it.

As I've posted elsewhere, I'm a huge fan of McGraw, and what she accomplished in the face of adversity this season. I love that most felt the Irish were the least likely #1 seed to win the title this year; no doubt many felt several #2 seeds were in a with a better chance. ND proved them all wrong. But attempting to compare what the Irish accomplished to where others ended up is a fool's errand. And drawing parallels, or lack thereof with respect to player development is even more ridiculous. Recall that ND won the NC in 2001. For the next nine seasons they failed to get beyond the Sweet 16. Six of those nine seasons they lost in the first or second round. ND still had some great players. Muffet was still the coach. Did she suddenly forget how to develop those recruits? Did it all come back to her suddenly in 2010, when things turned around in a big way for the Irish, finally culminating in this year's result. Maybe these traits are one decade on, the next off?

Let's keep it real. There are always reasons for why things happen, both good and bad, for programs. And seldom are they what is speculated about on message boards. Or perhaps a part of what's going on makes it on to a forum, without full context, and with the poster's personal spin or agenda (incorrectly) accounting for the remaining details. Success happens when all the pieces are there - players, staff - even if you reach the bare minimum on one count, as happened with ND this season. But sometimes when everything looks the best on paper, the end result doesn't reflect that. That's happened to every program at some point, including the Irish. At other times things just click, even when all signs indicate they shouldn't.

With respect to our 2017 class, things will play out as they're supposed to. Whether all stay or all go, or we end up somewhere in between, life continues for all concerned. We are going to have a roster full of phenomenal players, and the recent success of this program will continue. I'd be a bit more surprised to hear that Chas has left the program, given the strides she made at the end of the season, and that she is all but guaranteed to play a significant role next year. If she does depart I doubt it will be for any of the reasons that have been mentioned on this board. She, and those around her realize her playing time and 'development' would not have been managed any better anywhere else. And they're also smart enough to know if they're hearing that from any quarter, that's not someone who has her best interests in mind. I can't see why she'd want to sit out for a full year, and start all over somewhere else - in particular, given the opportunity she is going to have this fall with the Horns. But if moving on is what's best for her, or if she thinks it is, we should all wish her the best.

With all that said, I hope we can stop talking about freshman playing time and development. Or comparing players and programs when it isn't possible to do that in any type of meaningful way. If you're trying to make a point you can find a hundred so-called "examples" to justify whatever position you're taking. But every recruit is different. Every roster is different. Strength of schedule and caliber of competition is different. Fitness levels are different. Ability to play defense or learn schemes are different. For each freshman that played a key role, or started or saw significant action their first season, there are a dozen others who didn't...including a long list of #1 recruits over the years. Coaches want all players to contribute, and top recruits in particular. No one is held out for philosophical reasons. We have one of the top staffs in the country. We develop talent as well as anyone, and better than most. Whatever happens, I am more excited than ever about this program. Great days are ahead!

 

Thank you for taking the time to write this thoughtful response.

 

overseasbbfan1 -- I'll add my thanks for this carefully reasoned piece. Out of all your great points, the one that hit me the most was about "player development." As you said, did Muffett forget how to develop players for a few years, and then somehow remember how to again? If we saw tape of Brooke, Ariel, Lashann, and others from a few years ago, we would see how much "player development" has transpired right here in our own program.

 

Destiny Littleton retweeted the women's locker room tweet I included on the Speculation thread; I will take that as a good sign for the moment.

 

Overseas.....one of the best posts in a long time.

 

I was not aware the Freshman 6'5 Center, Emer Nichols was leaving A&M; we recruited her for a while:

 

Yes it was!

 

looks like Tech (Lyndsey Whilby, 5-11 FR guard, Powder Springs, GA); TCU (Mikayla Christian, 5-9 SO guard, Round Rock, TX and Amber Ramirez, 5-8 SO guard, San Antonio, TX) and ISU (Bride Kennedy-Hopoate, 6-4 JR forward, Brisbane, Australia) are the only Big 12 schools so far that are losing players.

 

So sorry you're having such a difficult learning curve about the obvious.

 

Who wants to decipher the candidates?

 

Aside from two unnamed FF teams, USC and SC, it wuold seem there are 11 other possibilities for the one remaining finalist spot.

 

I'll bite. South Carolina (the obvious), Louisville, Mississippi State, NC State and Georgia.

 

Oh I see. On first reading I thought both USC and SC were finalists. But they were referring to South Carolina as USC.

 

I haven't really been keeping up with this, but USC and SC may be the same school.

 

Ashley Jones from WVU is transferring. That's a surprise too, as she played a lot of minutes for WVU.

 

Jones leaving is a surprise as she had the second most assists on the team and played over 17 mpg. The starting PG for WVU was a senior so Jones should have been looking at starting the next three years.

Well, given the specs of the five teams Anriel is looking at, I guess Texas could be one of them as we do have a very good communications dept.

 

Vivian Gray transferring to Oklahoma State. That's a good get for them.

 

Wow that is a surprise indeed! Looks like a package deal with her sister coming along as well. That was supposedly the reason she went to Fort Lewis, to play with her sister! She’s not really a wing and not sure she can match up in the Big 12 at the 4? She is definitely a player. She took Argyle to several state championships!!

 

Wow, the Vivian Gray transfer is a surprise to me too. She had a great year at DII Fort Lewis, was the conference freshman of the year and many thought she should have been the conference player of the year but was a 1st team all conf. selection. Her sister was not a huge factor on their college team, not sure if she will ever get in a game at OSU, maybe she will surprise us though. Since she is transferring up won't she be immediately eligible?