DB stuff

Discussion in 'On The Field' started by Chop, Sep 28, 2020.

  1. Chop

    Chop 2,500+ Posts

    Our D-backfield. Do we have a problem? Or is that sort of torching to be expected when playing in Lubbock against a QB of the caliber of Bowman? On the bright side, we're making a lot of picks.

    I'm not a DB guy, but it seems that against a 3 step/quick drop/quick release passing scheme like Tech runs with Bowman, it might work better for the coverage (esp. the CBs) to play tight on the line, jam the WRs getting off the line, frustrate their attempts to get the pass off within 3 seconds, and let our D-front get to the QB. Maybe we see more of this when we're playing against lesser QBs than Bowman and lesser WRs than Vasher.

    While I want to see more pressure from our DEs, I don't think pass rushing was the big problem. You can't expect the DLs/DEs to get Bowman in 2-3 seconds before he releases.
     
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  2. RainH2burntO

    RainH2burntO 2,500+ Posts

    Great post. I am especially fond of your notion that a tighter, pressing style coverage should be considered when teams are beating you with quick-hitters. Another thing to do is mix and match with a couple dlinemen and linebackers moving.....have linebackers harder to read by moving in toward line presnap then back out into coverage and linemen who arent getting penetration occassionally stand up or step off the ball right after initial push and attempt to bat balls down or at least get into vision and throwing lanes...more taught technique than schemed for obviously.
    One caveat....these methods... especially press coverage, are typically made effective by the opposing team's offense feeling like they won't have much time to throw....But after two weeks it seems an intentional product of scheme, rather than necessity, against us for teams to limit QB holding ball and throw short. It will be real interesting, because the most effective thing Duggan did well last year is launch an accurate deep ball against us...which obviously takes more time.
     
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    Last edited: Sep 28, 2020
  3. wadster

    wadster 5,000+ Posts

    You just have to mix it up. Gotta jump a route sometimes too and try and get a pic 6. Play press, play zone, drop a DE into the passing lane. But the main thing in playing Tech is to stop them in the redzone and force FGs. That was the #1 thing we didn't get done on Sat. That and special teams play. When tackling was as bad as it was, getting stops in the red zone wasn't going to happen.Several of their TD's were from too far out.
     
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  4. RainH2burntO

    RainH2burntO 2,500+ Posts

    "Mix it up"

    This^^^^^^
     
  5. MUCHO

    MUCHO 100+ Posts

    Agree with both posts. Seems like we could use the art of confusion on D a lot more including by disguising our defense / coverage, using LBs and DLs to drop into underneath coverage, and switching up our D play-call after Tech changed its play based on the D we were showing. On this last point, it didn’t seem to me that we changed our D after Tech adjusted its play-call based on the D we were showing. The accuracy of the pre-snap read by the QB is critical for quick-hitters. Even the slightest uncertainty can create havoc for an offense. I realize that creating confusion requires a healthy amount of talent and football IQ or else it can backfire. I think we have the former. Not as sure about the latter, but seems like it’s there as well for most of our players.
     
  6. SabreHorn

    SabreHorn 5,000+ Posts

    Wadster.

    You left out grabass, which our DBs excel at while whiffing on the tackle. While the Horns (I cringe calling them that) make one or two sports center worthy plays, they missed 30-40 tackles at the same time; God help us if this OL gets hit with blitz packages.
     
  7. Chop

    Chop 2,500+ Posts

    With Ossai we certainly have the right personnel to drop/flex him back into coverage sometimes to trick the opposing O.
     
  8. Chop

    Chop 2,500+ Posts

    The ball-hawking aspect of our DBs on the deeper and mid-range throws seems better than in a long while. Scheme may have something to do with it.
     
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  9. txhorn_et

    txhorn_et 100+ Posts

    Why do defensive backs in today's game never see the ball? I can't tell you how many interceptions I've made from the couch!
     
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  10. Chinstrap

    Chinstrap 500+ Posts

    Fundaments? Angles, tackling and PI because the defender does not look back at the ball. Middle school, high school, college coaching?????

    Texas and zero u may have something in common with their “D’s”. Rattler’s arm and release is the real deal. Could be a long day.
     
  11. Horns11

    Horns11 5,000+ Posts

    These systems like Wells' or Mike Leach's aren't going to fool the NFL defenses like it does to HS and college players. I think we get spoiled by watching NFL corners and safeties (well, minus the Cowboys) fly around the field and get hands on the ball, or at least wrap up a lot of the time. The offense will always have the advantage in a quick-hitter style of spread. It's going to be bend but don't break for everyone they play, but the ones who force the errors are the ones who can limit both points and possessions.

    Something else to consider is that we've allowed WAY more than 331 yards passing to Tech in the past. I think Symons threw for like 470 or something when Chance Mock barely pulled out the 2003 win. And Harrell as well for each of his 3 starts against us. This game was close because of other deficiencies (ST and some offensive lapses for 2/3rds of the game), whereas I thought the D actually did a decent job on all but 4 of the Tech series.

    I think we had a decent plan going into Tech, but a couple of things fell apart:

    1. We tried to keep things on the outside and use the sideline as an extra defender. That part seems ok in theory. The bad part was that one defender wouldn't be enough to contain and then they'd get the ball back into the middle of the field in YAC and no one would be around. The safeties need to do a better job of keeping the play in front of them and limiting their access back into the field. Look at the first drive of the game. All safeties and a LB (Overshown) make the tackles. The corners were biting on the press stuff way too early and panicking.

    2. Range. Vasher and Ezukanma are those guys who stand at 6'6" and 6'3", but their armspans actually make them about 7'0" and 6'9". I don't care how fast Jamison is; he's not going to be able to compete for those balls if they're thrown in the right place. This could be something where we allow the receivers space to go towards the sideline on a fade but the safeties are doubling up, kind of like most of Sterns' picks from 2018. Plus, while Josh Thompson had the game of his career against UTEP, I think he let it go to his head on some of those plays on Saturday.

    3. 3rd and short. We gave them way too many. It's too easy to line up with 3rd and short and pass for a little quick slant or hitch against a team on its heels... especially one looking to stop the run (on every play except 1, I guess).

    4. Mental aspects. We'd get angry, and angry guys start to grab for facemasks or hold on routes and those don't necessarily affect the outcome of the play.
     
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  12. HalRex

    HalRex 100+ Posts

    Y’all are getting close to my personal dominance of the armchair coaching league.:yes:
     
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  13. nashhorn

    nashhorn 2,500+ Posts

    I think Sam had a momentary relapse simply trying to do too much. I’m counting on this just being early season jitters but he definitely made some throws that looked like his freshman year. Not hitting on the accuracy the idiot commentators dissed him on I’m referring to the double coverage and desperation throws that could easily have been pics.
    He’ll be ok because he’s Sam and knows how to self critique but TT was a good lesson for him.
     
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  14. Pomspoms

    Pomspoms 1,000+ Posts

    I'm not a DB guy, but it seems that against a 3 step/quick drop/quick release passing scheme like Tech runs with Bowman, it might work better for the coverage (esp. the CBs) to play tight on the line, jam the WRs getting off the line, frustrate their attempts to get the pass off within 3 seconds, and let our D-front get to the QB

    That's what i said after tech's first series. Guess the coaches were too busy at the time to implement my plan
     
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  15. Chop

    Chop 2,500+ Posts

    Fortunately Duggan is no Bowman. I’m not sure about the other TCU QBs.

    My bigger concern is TCUs D front, but that’s for another thread.
     
  16. Run Pincher

    Run Pincher 1,000+ Posts

    But But But, TH says Chris Ash is the best teacher of proper tackling technique in the college football world today.
     
  17. Chop

    Chop 2,500+ Posts

    Sigh.

    You’re tempting me to post that old Darrell Royal Coca Cola-sponsored video on tackling technique. It has to come out at least once a year.
     
  18. SabreHorn

    SabreHorn 5,000+ Posts

    What is this?

    Do the players have to take this course??

    Seattle, can you help tutoring this?
     
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  19. Chop

    Chop 2,500+ Posts

    We're still playing for the highlight reel, and not breaking down and wrapping up. Basic open field tackling needs to be taught, and practiced. The coaches need to jump all over any DB who gives up 10+ yards then flexes his muscles in a pose. You just 'lost' that play, man, so what are you doing??? You look like a dopey clown (trying to keep it clean here...).
     
  20. Horns11

    Horns11 5,000+ Posts

    I think a bigger issue from the OU game was that our front 6 couldn't get the same kind of pressure that KSU and ISU got. Flexing after tackles 20 yards downfield is asinine, but the play shouldn't have gotten 20 yards downfield to begin with, and that part wasn't the fault of the DB's typically.

    This change-o-switch-o D that Ash was supposed to implement with Ossai being more of a DE and less of a weakside LB was supposed to generate the kind of pass rush we saw in the Alamo Bowl. Well... it hasn't really happened, except when Alfred Collins has been in there. I think there needs to be more accountability from guys like Graham and Ojomo.
     
  21. rick mueller

    rick mueller Burnt Orange Bleeder

    Come on man! If a coach spoke to a player about flexing, he (the player) would be uncomfortable. He might even refuse to play any more. Get with the times here! :brickwall::fire::whiteflag:
     
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  22. Duck Dodgers

    Duck Dodgers 500+ Posts

    Don't be dissing on the Flex! The Flex is often the best part of the time that UT is on defense. It's not like they're really going to make a stop, so might as well get some laughs from it.

    Hopefully, we'll see the defense work their way through the three classic Hulk Hogan Flexes:

    The double python:
    https://static1.srcdn.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/Hulk-Hogan-Flexing-in-a-WWE-Ring.jpg

    The opposing pipes:
    http://www.onrembobine.fr/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Hulk-Hogan.jpg

    And of course, everyone's favorite Flex, the Javelin Thrower!
    https://s3.amazonaws.com/rapgenius/1369162884_hogan_682_480266a.jpg
     
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    Last edited: Oct 22, 2020
  23. Statalyzer

    Statalyzer 10,000+ Posts

    The Flex?

    [​IMG]
     
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  24. Duck Dodgers

    Duck Dodgers 500+ Posts

  25. rick mueller

    rick mueller Burnt Orange Bleeder

    Stat - Many here are prolly too young to get this.
     
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  26. Omniscient.one

    Omniscient.one 500+ Posts

    Who cares? Our best DB and perhaps best playmaker, maybe second to Jamison, is second string. He gets to watch those Chris Brown flexes on, in all honesty, great hits by CB but only when the ball is 3 yards past first down marker. Why BJ isn’t playing is politics, plain and simple. He knows he’s better. So do his friends and family and NFL scouts. He’s gonna make a lotta money in the big leagues while Chris Brown will be a middle school DB coach. Think Marcus Johnson on steroids
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2020
  27. Omniscient.one

    Omniscient.one 500+ Posts

    Sure, Foster goes for the big hit, and sometimes costs us a yard or two. But he’s the only decleater out there and forces fumbles at an incredible ratio given bench/injury time
     

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