The First 100 days

Discussion in 'West Mall' started by theiioftx, Nov 10, 2016.

  1. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 5,000+ Posts

    Overall, I don't have a fundamental problem but it seems superficial. The language requirement seems especially bogus. Keep in mind, the past English language requirement has been for naturalization, not simply a green card. Moving it up to the point of immigration doesn't make any sense. If get a job offer to work in Germany do i have to demonstrate my German language proficiency to get a work visa when the company may operate in English? I know a Project Manager from Texas working on a global technology implementation based in Paris. I guarantee she doesn't speak French. I'm sure I'd learn a fair amount of German were I to work there and if I chose to permanently live there (naturalization) I'd expect to have to be fluent in the local language.
     
  2. ProdigalHorn

    ProdigalHorn 10,000+ Posts

    That was my point - I don't think this is something that you can quantify very simply, and especially with the extremely simplistic scoring system that was set up. If immigration is going to be a more one-by-one decision - and I believe it should be - there needs to be more latitude and discretion allowed, and it needs to be a lot less arbitrary. (Why the Nobel? Because it's the only one the guys could think of in the 15-minute brainstorm session that it took to come up with the system?)
     
    Seattle Husker likes this.
  3. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 5,000+ Posts

    What's lost in this debate is that the current system isn't arbitrary. It's first come first served and it does take into account the specifics of the individual. I've had 8-10 H1B individuals reporting up through me and the voluminous administration to justify hiring them or extending their visa is significant. I set aside $10k in budget (Immigration Lawyers costs on the company side) when I suspect we'll need to consider sponsoring an H1B for a hard to fill role. Any candidates I consider need to have a Masters or greater in the field plus experience in the role I'm hiring and I have to demonstrate proof that I can't find the resource domestically.

    With that said, the immigration discussion isn't slowing down the offshoring of work to India, China and others because most work can be done anywhere. Hospitals are outsourcing x-ray reviews to radiologists in India, for example. If what we are trying to do is save American jobs then this immigration discussion is only gnawing at the problem on the edges.
     
  4. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

  5. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    Trump's China trade crackdown coming Monday

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/08/11/trumps-china-trade-crackdown-coming-monday-241558

    Trump on Monday will call for an investigation into China over allegations that the nation violated U.S. intellectual property rights and forced technology transfers, the official said. While it's unclear how much detail Trump will get into in the announcement, administration officials expect U.S. Trade Representative Robert Lighthizer to open an investigation against China under Section 301 of the Trade Act of 1974.
     
  6. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    The woman who wrote this, Nina Burleigh (Newsweek), once publicly offered Bill Clinton oral sex


    [​IMG]
    “Six months in, and the Trump women are well on their way to normalizing the footwear of the beauty pageant.”

    ..............................

    Here she is back in 1998 on Bubba --

    "The president's foot lightly, and presumably accidentally, brushed mine once under the table. His hand touched my wrist while he was dealing the cards. When I got up and shook his hand at the end of the game, his eyes wandered over to my bike-wrecked, naked legs. And slowly it dawned on me as I walked away: He found me attractive."

    (It is) "not unusual for women" to swoon over him.
    "I'd be happy to give him a {oral sex} ....."

    http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/washingtonpost/doc/408388647.html?FMT=ABS&FMTS=ABS:FT&type=current&date=Jul 6, 1998&author=Howard Kurtz&pub=&edition=&startpage=&desc=A Reporter With Lust in Her Hearts
     
  7. BrntOrngStmpeDe

    BrntOrngStmpeDe 500+ Posts

    That is true but it is one of the few levers in our control. It is absolutely true that off-shoring and automation are huge factors in the loss of many jobs in the US but for some reason most people don't seem to want to connect the dots. Immigration volume has a huge impact on the remaining jobs.

    In the past technology was both a lever to increase productivity and to increase employment. In 2011 or so, there was a divergence of this trend. Companies are indeed becoming more productive but they are doing so without hiring. The inevitable conclusion of this, is that there will be fewer and fewer jobs in the future. So what does a country (or even world for that matter) do in an environment when there are fewer jobs in the future.

    IMO, the one thing you absolutely DON'T DO is invite in more workers to compete for the shrinking pool of jobs. I don't care if there are "some jobs Americans won't do" or "a shortage of talent in IT". These problems are fixable with supply/demand wage adjustments. Having to find jobs and/or government handouts for the growing number of unemployed down the road, will not be so easy.

    If I have to pick between securing a future for my son and my grandchildren and being a hospitable neighbor to the worlds immigrants....it's an easy choice for me.

    I for one think the Olympic medal thing is unnecessary, and perhaps we don't need the English Proficiency for a green card but it should absolutely be a substantial requirement for citizenship.

    I would also advocate for a jobs metric to be part of the cap/limit/target for immigration totals. If unemployment is below XXX% then we open up the spigot, if unemployment is higher than XXX% then we turn off the spigot.
     
    Brad Austin likes this.
  8. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 5,000+ Posts

    Maybe we need to break out the argument between high and low skilled labor because the solutions HAVE to be different, IMHO. There is already a language requirement for citizenship too so let's agree that moving it up to the start of the immigration process is dumb when it's already handled in the naturalization process.

    High skilled workers. Let's call these IT/Developers because in actuality that's who is taken all the H1-B visas today. Why are we importing them? Our colleges simply aren't putting out enough of them. Colleges are vastly scaling up their computer engineering programs but absent lowering standards (which are already occurring, BTW) serving the tech need of not just silicon valley but every major corporation the trajectory is still insufficient. The technological innovation that will slow or be stymied without the infusion of offshore tech resources. That will be significant impact and will put US companies at a severe growth disadvantage compared to our international competitors. For example, I already delay capital funded projects due to resource scale constraints and I'm sure I'm not different than any other technology leader.

    Low skilled labor. Let's call these the "jobs that nobody wants". Illegal immigration is filling these roles, not the legal immigration process called out above. While the above is accelerating the elimination of jobs, does just the opposite, IMHO. For example, field labor is helping a farmer not to have to purchase equipment. They are taking wages at a much lower wage/benefits than your typical citizen laborer. That's a problem as the American laborer is likely sitting in a welfare office, begging on a street corner or finding some other charitable organization/person to survive. I've consistently advocated for the government to crackdown on companies that live off illegal labor but am a supporter of the farm workers visas. Companies like the Mir-a-lago resort need to take a flying leap.
     
  9. BrntOrngStmpeDe

    BrntOrngStmpeDe 500+ Posts

    I work in an industry that uses draws for salespeople. if you're not familiar, it basically amounts to a small advance of funds to be recaptured later when you sell something and earn a sufficient paycheck to cover the advance. I think companies needing IT talent should move to something similar. Hire the worker, put them on an advance/draw type system with a guaranteed pay increase once they achieve a certain milestone in productivity. The draw would amount to a lien on future wages so if the employee left before they become productive to the point of repaying the advance then it would be recoverable by the employer.

    1. Creates a new talent pool for specifically the skills that XYZ company deems important and ensures that they aren't just training an employee to move down the road as soon as they get the certification/skill
    2. Enables the employee to develop the desired skill while they still get at least a small paycheck until the point at which they become a true asset to the employer.

    As for the illegal workers...making $7 under the table...$1200-$1400 a month... Who can and likely will bring 2-3 family members with them eventually that will likely take up, on average $12,000 per student/per year in our school system. (not to mention other services) That's a big net loss to the economy. I would rather pay $1.29/lb of oranges (vs. 1.09) due to increased wages from $7 under-table to $9-10 real wages to legal US citizen.

    In other words, I would rather pay the costs directly in the form of higher prices for home construction and agricultural products than pay indirectly through government programs. sorry for the stereotyping just trying to make a rhetorical argument.
     
  10. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 5,000+ Posts

    I like your creativity. The "draws" idea left me pondering how to put that model in place for software development lifecycle contributor. Given how many things could impact the quality and timeliness of a project I'll need to mull it over longer. Companies like IBM are spending more time bringing on non-degreed certificated people from "software boot camps" which will be curious to see the results a few years down the road. It's a longer term approach to training developers rather than hiring a pompous kid for 6-figures out of college. I suspect they are also looking for a cheaper worker which I'd never fault a company for doing. Developers can be very expensive in today's job market.

    Maybe it's my Nebraska roots but I tend to side with the farmer when it comes to field labor. For example, if there were no pickers (due to wages that pay by the bushel picked) for apples in the State of Washington the crops would rot and/or be so expensive that apples would nearly cease to exist as a fruit. Much of the fruit/vegetables that can't be machine harvested would flow to external markets to service them who have access to lower wage labor.

    Where I am critical of is factories and processing plants that knowingly make use of illegal immigration. Our government has given a blind eye to those businesses in the past. If they made actual unannounced visits to a Dallas cabinet manufacturer (name purposely excluded) they'd capture several hundred illegals on any given shift. Even now, they prefer to leave these big businesses alone and catch them on the street than at their place of employment. The draw for them to be in the US is not our education or healthcare, something most illegals care little about, but rather the $$ from a job that is exponentially more than their home country. Cut that off and they have no reason to be here.
     
  11. BrntOrngStmpeDe

    BrntOrngStmpeDe 500+ Posts

    I'm absolutely on board with this. illegal immigration would almost come to a complete halt if we mandated e-verify and heavily fined offenders. Especially since we are requiring more people to have valid id's.

    I believe most of the current illegals in the US would elect to go home as well. We could even be generous about it and provide them some assistance to go back. Offer a bonus for hopping on the southbound buses early in the process. I'd rather spend the money that way than a stupid wall. With that remittance number someone cited earlier ($128B or so) we could likely offer $1000 to each one and still come out better off. Finger print and photo them for future reference. "if you come back illegally, it's a mandatory 3 year sentence".
     
  12. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 5,000+ Posts

    Per CNBC:
    Winning! :(
     
  13. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 5,000+ Posts

    Yesterday...


    Today...


    Winning!
     
  14. mchammer

    mchammer 2,500+ Posts

    Actually it is leftists who want politicize everything that is undermining their case.
     
  15. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 5,000+ Posts

    It's always the leftists fault. All the CEO's are leftists. Trump should be absolved for his yo-yo response to Charlottesville. How do you know what Trump really feels? What he says off the cuff (Saturday and Tuesday) and what he reads on the teleprompter (Monday)! The teleprompter is what his handlers (Kelly) thinks he needs to say. When Trump is unscripted he offers the moral equivocation that has business leaders literally running from him. That's not a "leftist" problem but a Trump problem.

    That second tweet, today? Trump lied to you and me. That isn't even spin but a straight up lie. "I am ending both" is shorthand for the panel members disbanding it. Unless Trump is saying "I could have replaced EVERYONE but chose not to".



    Sources familiar with the call told the Journal it was "cordial" but that Trump claimed credit in a tweet for disbanding the group after Schwarzman told him of its decision.
     
  16. rattfatt

    rattfatt 500+ Posts

    Trump is an embarrassment and he and his team are the most incompetent that America has ever had. George Bush was just as dumb as Trump but at least Bush had smart people around him.
     
  17. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    Nice to see Trump fighting back. I think one of the things that helped get him elected is that voters sensed that he would not simply roll over into a fetal position when faced with a big opposition media campaign (like the current one). The people of the country had been waiting a long time for a national Republican willing to stand up to them. I think the majority of his voters want him fighting back. Even on sensitive issues such as this one.

    It should be pretty clear now to reasonable minds that the reaction to Charlottesville was orchestrated and planned. However it may have started, what it has become is a major effort make it stick to Trump. It's a coordinated attack by the Dems/DNC, probably funded by the usual suspect and perpetuated 24/7 by the MSM. They want Trump removed, by any means. This is just another shot. After failing with their 6-month long mantra of 'Russia, Russia, Russia!', they needed a replacement strategy. So they went back to the usual American Left bag of dirty tricks.


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    Last edited: Aug 17, 2017 at 10:25 AM
  18. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    Some support for my position above

     
  19. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    Even 44% of Dems agree with Trump on the statue thing
    + 86% of Republicans, 61% of Independents

    Again, I think any other national R of recent memory would have already rolled over on this issue

    African-Americans are divided on the question — but a plurality agree they should stay, 44 percent to 40 percent. Two-thirds of whites and Latinos believe the statues should remain as well.
    The only groups in which a plurality said the statues should be removed are Democrats, especially those identifying as “strong Democrats,” those identifying as “very liberal” and those who disapprove of the president.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2017 at 11:08 AM
  20. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    And Trump was right that they will be coming for George Washington next

     
  21. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

  22. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    Bannon thinks all of this helps in the long run
    That lefties are misplaying it (again)

    And the polls do tend to support this idea

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2017 at 11:39 AM
    Brad Austin likes this.
  23. BrntOrngStmpeDe

    BrntOrngStmpeDe 500+ Posts

    And ultimately this is why I think many that don't support a white supremacist message are still wiling to be on the same side of this particular issue as the neoNazi groups. I detest much of what they stand for but I'm not willing to let the BLM and leftist ideology go unchallenged on removing statues. It's always give an inch, take a mile. It happened with acceptance of LGBT leading to gay marriage and if left unchecked this wave will eventually have minorities demanding reparations, and more affirmative action.
     
  24. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    Do "white supremacists" make up more than 1% of the US?
    I doubt it. I am not sure antifa + white supremacists = 1%
    This incident is not really about them and, IMO, time spent discussing their merits or lack of them are but wasted effort.
    What this current matter is really about is Trump-hatred. And it is pretty transparent.
     
    I35 likes this.
  25. Brad Austin

    Brad Austin 2,500+ Posts

    And that's exactly why so many Reps today side with DT over other Rep leaders. The career politicians have no concept of this absolute truth you stated above.

    Appeasement gets nothing...I mean absolutely nothing from today's Left. They'll never stop, they'll never return the courtesy. They're parasites that thrive off others' misery.

    Common people understand this very well because most of us have all spent our lives in the melting pot. We know there's good and bad of all colors and forms.

    And we also know the bad ones will group together and never stop pushing until more ruthless resistance shuts it down.

    The political elites raised and residing in their ivory towers have no f'n clue that once you take a step back in kindness they'll kick you in the nuts and demand two more.

    It used to be somewhat tolerable from the left with a shake of the head when demands had some semblance of sanity or confused logic behind them.

    Now it's just lunacy and all out attack on American society and traditions. Soon there will be no choice but to resist with equal or greater force.
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2017 at 12:53 PM
    I35 likes this.
  26. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 5,000+ Posts

    The danger is thinking some individual interviewed by a right-wing source with an agenda represents the "left", let alone the center. The extremes are driving the dialogue which is what is escalating the rhetoric to unfathomable proportions.

    Trump was grossly negligent for not immediately slamming the Unite the Right marchers, particularly since the vast majority was chanting traditional nazi chants on Friday night. Make no mistake, this was a white supremacist gathering around the statue removal issues, not the other way around.
     
  27. BrntOrngStmpeDe

    BrntOrngStmpeDe 500+ Posts

    But that as been how this has unfolded over the last 20 years. Some demographic that represents 5% of all American views gets a toe hold in the democratic party and uses the Democratic base (specifically minorities ) that never move too far from the mothership to execute their niche issue. Both parties have this problem but I find it incredible the way the Democratic base gives up so much of their typical culture to hold true to the platform of the left.

    Maybe you've been around them having served but when I was in the Army 80% of unit was Hispanic and African American. My soldiers didn't agree on much but one thing they almost universally agreed on was their intolerance for homosexuals. It wasn't just gay marriage, these guys railed on LGBT. And this wasn't 2 decades ago. This was 4 years ago. And now these folks are voting straight ticket for a democratic party that has this as a core tenant.

    On top of that, the democrats don't usually even get legislation passed to enact their agenda, they just get enough cases in court to force the issue even when the vast majority of America doesn't support the decision. It doesn't matter if this one guy represents the majority of Dems. It will make it's way into the common dem thought process if not challenged.
     
    I35 likes this.
  28. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    While the MSM has been beating up Trump hard the last week, a new Quinnipiac University poll came out suggesting Millennials (18-34) believe Trump has stronger convictions than Democrats or the GOP.

    35% believe Trump bases his policies on a set of core values compared to 18% for Rs and 22% for Ds.

    In addition, 59% of Millennials believe that Trump does whatever is politically convenient. While 79% believe that Rs do whatever is politically convenient, and 76% believe the same of Dem.

    https://poll.qu.edu/images/polling/us/us08172017_Ucva52n.pdf/


    [​IMG]
     
    I35 likes this.
  29. Joe Fan

    Joe Fan 10,000+ Posts

    Still funny

     
    mchammer likes this.
  30. Seattle Husker

    Seattle Husker 5,000+ Posts

    The Democrats have definitely been under the influence of their extremes. The Republicans have resisted that until the Tea Party came about then later the alt-right.

    Yeah, I experienced the same phenomenon in the Army as you albeit probably to a greater degree in the early 90's. Of course, I was a middle-class liberal Seattle guy thrown into my unit full of rednecks and minorities. The culture shock was extreme. Attitudes change though, just like interracial relationships being commonplace, all it takes is for some of these same individuals to experience a friend coming out of the closet or family member to finally think "damn...I was wrong". The vast majority of America now supports gay marriage per any recent polling.
     

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