Trump has lost ability to make deals

Discussion in 'West Mall' started by Musburger1, May 10, 2019.

  1. Musburger1

    Musburger1 2,500+ Posts

    He’s blown it. Nobody any longer trusts either Trump or the US government. Not China, not North Korea, not Turkey, not Iran, not Venezuela, not the Palestinians, not Russia, and not our allies in the EU including Germany. Threats, sanctions, and financial warfare have replaced diplomacy and it isn’t working. Trump and his entourage (Bolton, Pompeo, the CIA, and the hardasses within the Pentagon) attempted to give ultimatums, orchestrate coups, and use financial tools to bring target countries to the table. They have called the bluffs and now Trump is in the corner without a way out. Tom Luongo summarizes.

    Luongo: Will Trump's Vanity Destroy The Global Economy?
     
  2. Statalyzer

    Statalyzer 10,000+ Posts

    Was he ever that great at "making deals", at offering someone something they really wanted to arrive as a mutually beneficial solution or talking them into making bigger concessions to him in exchange for small concessions for them, as opposed to exploiting legal loopholes or using force of personality to get his way?
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2019
  3. iatrogenic

    iatrogenic 1,000+ Posts

    And our economy is a rolling ball of butcher knives. Hmm....go figure.
     
  4. Monahorns

    Monahorns 1,000+ Posts

    The tariffs so far haven't accomplished what Trump is wanting with China. That is going to hurt. Them and us.

    The economy is doing okay but it isn't even healthy enough for the Fed to continue its interest rate increase program. That belies their pronouncements of confidence. They are also starting to consider negative interest rates and higher inflation targets in the case that the economy doesn't continue to improve. It is low rates and inflation that have stagnated our economy since the 2008 recession.

    Dark clouds loom on the horizon. Labor market participation is still low compared to 2000 and before.
     
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  5. huisache

    huisache 2,500+ Posts

    Quit picking on the president. He has overcome the affliction of bone spurs and will win over the chicoms
     
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  6. iatrogenic

    iatrogenic 1,000+ Posts

    As the kids say, "ya think?"
     
  7. BrntOrngStmpeDe

    BrntOrngStmpeDe 1,000+ Posts

    I think China is going to hold to see if he wins the next election. They will wait it out because a communist regime can make people endure the short term pain for what the party sees as a long term benefit. If there is one area that our system of government is weaker at, it is the ability to set long term goals and stick to them. Although it has benefits in other ways, our 4yr cycle puts us at a disadvantage in these type negotiations. I think Trump has approached this one in just the right way, but if China starts to believe someone else will be in charge in 2 years, then he has little leverage.
     
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  8. BrntOrngStmpeDe

    BrntOrngStmpeDe 1,000+ Posts

    Having said that, Trump always seems to play like he is the big stack at the table and sitting in position. He only has one gear. He makes a huge bet no matter what his cards are and just hopes the other side backs down. When it works, he looks like a master. When it doesn't, he looks like a dope.
     
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  9. iatrogenic

    iatrogenic 1,000+ Posts

    Interesting view. What are a few examples of him looking like a dope?
     
  10. huisache

    huisache 2,500+ Posts

    A beautiful wall MEXICO WILL PAY FOR?
     
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  11. iatrogenic

    iatrogenic 1,000+ Posts

  12. I35

    I35 2,500+ Posts

    Too many short minded people that only looks at the short term. We are going to get a better deal no doubt. How much of a better deal is the question. But we had to do something. If Trump can get the deal fair like it should be, we will see the GDP rise like we’ve never seen before..... or not even imagine it could.
     
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  13. Horn6721

    Horn6721 10,000+ Posts

    I wonder what the Haters wanr. To not try to get a fairer deal with those who have screwed us for years?
     
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  14. huisache

    huisache 2,500+ Posts

    how about spending a trillion a year more than they take in? Can that be the base of the economic stimulus? Maybe?

    Obama did it to breath life into a flattened economy and then kept doing it every year to keep it up; what is Trump's excuse? He is supposed to be a business genius but I see more of the same.

    Did he quit at Brown after reading Keynes and never catch up?
     
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  15. iatrogenic

    iatrogenic 1,000+ Posts

    how about spending a trillion a year more than they take in? Can that be the base of the economic stimulus? Maybe?

    Obama did it to breath life into a flattened economy and then kept doing it every year to keep it up;
    ________________

    It is unlikely that the government deficit spending caused the great economy we have today. If that were the case, it would have been great under Obama, but that never happened. I'll go with lower tax rates and less regulation. In addition, the government spending for 2019 is only partially executed, so it doesn't follow that that is causing the higher GDP.

    Also, please note how tax cuts are adding more tax revenues to the government coffers.

    Anything else?
     
  16. LongestHorn

    LongestHorn 500+ Posts

  17. Horn6721

    Horn6721 10,000+ Posts

    Longest?
    Did revenues actually decrease? The way I read your link was that the revenues were less than the projection by the CBO. From your link
    "The most appropriate test of the revenue impact of TCJA is to compare (a) actual revenues in FY2018 with (b) predicted revenues in FY2018 assuming Congress had not passed the legislation. "
    Most other sites show an increase in actual revenue 2018 vs 2017.
     
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  18. Monahorns

    Monahorns 1,000+ Posts

    I am tired of 7-11. I buy gasoline and Big Gulp after Big Gulp of my favorite soft drink. But they never buy anything from me. I need a new trade deal with them since they are screwing me over.
     
  19. LongestHorn

    LongestHorn 500+ Posts

    No one said decreased except you. Read it again before calling it fake news. Or not, idc.

    “In fact, the actual amount of revenue collected in FY2018 was significantly lower than the Congressional Budget Office (CBO)’s projection of FY2018 revenue from January 2017—before the tax cuts were signed. The shortfall is $275 billion, or 7.6 percent of revenues that were expected before the tax cuts took place. Given that the economy grew, unless one can find some other change that caused a large revenue loss, the data imply that TCJA reduced revenues (Figure 1) – substantially.”
     
  20. iatrogenic

    iatrogenic 1,000+ Posts

    Oh hell, it was less than the CBO estimate!

    The CBO estimates suck. Check some of their crap dealing with Obamacare.
     
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  21. Horn6721

    Horn6721 10,000+ Posts

    I said decrease. You said hundreds of billions of dollars less not more
    Using a site that said revenue was lower than projections.

    Are you really trying to paste over your silly remark with word games?
     
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  22. huisache

    huisache 2,500+ Posts

    Re President Bone Spurs looking like a dope: New Jersey Generals

    Childish name calling

    Hosting a fake tv contest

    Can't hire or keep good help

    Paying for puzzee when he could grab all he wants (though he has never admitted doing so)

    Acting like the Chicom dictator is his pal

    Appearing in public

    Turning the 4th of July celebration into a red, white and blue version of the 1937 Party Congress in Nuremberg
     
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  23. iatrogenic

    iatrogenic 1,000+ Posts

    Pretty strong stuff Lib. Of course he wasn’t president for many of your examples. You forgot to list policies, or matters of substance, but that is typical.
     
  24. huisache

    huisache 2,500+ Posts

    If I am a liberal, why did I not vote for Hillary or Obama or her husband?

    Most of the stuff I mentioned was during his presidency but the original post re his looking like a dope by Stampede was not limited to his buffoonish presidency.

    It is characteristic of his lemmings that they can see none of the buffoonery in front of them. His insane tariff war with his good friend the Chinese Chicom dictator ought to be enough but how about running as a no new empire candidate and then appointing Bolton to a position of authority?

    How about his about faces on the former stooges who have turned on him to limit how much time they face in the pokey?

    How about hauling his relatives into decision making positions in spite of their lack of any kind of credentials or, in the case of his son in law, of the capability of passing a background check?

    How about denigrating his attorney general repeatedly in public because he rightfully recused himself?

    The only good thing I can say about him other than that I dislike the people who most hate him and enjoy watching their misery is this: he has appointed two of Scalia's acolytes to the Supreme Court. Is that illiberal of me?
     
  25. Monahorns

    Monahorns 1,000+ Posts

    huisache, I am with you. I really dislike his bad trade policy and that he has rolled over to the warmongers in his administration. Also, he has no thought to reform/cut spending by welfare programs and military.

    He is growing the deficit and brow beating the Fed to keep interest rates artificially low.

    But I do love the tears of those who irrationally hate him.
     
  26. LongestHorn

    LongestHorn 500+ Posts

    Your summation was rational until it wasn't.
     
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  27. Monahorns

    Monahorns 1,000+ Posts

    My summation was completely rational. There are things that any reasonable person should criticize Trump for, but that doesn't include baseless collusion charges and obstruction claims ignoring a President's Constitutional authority.

    Republicans are hypocritical when they support Trump's protectionism on trade and deficit growth.
     
  28. Garmel

    Garmel 1,000+ Posts

    It is pretty funny watching you guys desperately grasping for straws going after Trump. I wonder what goofy crap you guys will come up with if Trump wins the trade war.
     
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  29. huisache

    huisache 2,500+ Posts

    please identify one situation where anybody ever won a trade war.

    It is a stupid idea and both economies are going to pay for it big time.

    The big problem with China is their theft of intellectual property and a tariff war will not settle that.

    both sides are going to have to cave and then both will announce victory and both will be wrong.
     
  30. Monahorns

    Monahorns 1,000+ Posts

    I am only criticizing his tariffs current effects. If China agrees to free trade and quits stealing IP as a result of Trump's tactics I will be nothing but happy for Trump and applaud him. I understand that there is a chance good will come from Trump's trade policy with China. However, it is clearly hurting it right now. In response his only solution is to subsidize farmers more. So more Socialism as a result of his trade policy. If you can't at least admit that it isn't going so well right now, you have a problem.

    Personally, I don't think China will budge. They don't have to answer to their citizens like US Presidents do. They will just run over people with tanks if the people get too feisty. US Presidents only get 8 years as it is. China is probably going to wait to see who wins the 2024 election before they seriously consider anything different. Now I admit I could be wrong. I hope I am wrong.
     

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